Cyprus-Forum.com

[Agios Amvrosios]

The Turkish Settlers living in my Parent's houses did not build anything.

I'll give them 20 euros to fuck off. Fair?

We'll See you in Court!

[insan]

I Perfectly agree with you. That is why GCs are trying to stop this illegal construction and sale of GC properties to foreigners. Because if it is left to continue, it will make things much more difficult. As you are aware, one of the major reasons that GCs rejected the A-plan was the property provisions and the huge area/value gap that was going to be covered by compensation means. The needed amount is huge and the TC community is simply unable to cover it, not in the next 100 years. The current GDP of the “TRNC” is less than half a billion Cyprus pounds (450 millions.)

Gist of the problem is the "political equality" of two communities and the guarantorship of Turkey. We all know that GC leadership will never accept these two demands of TC community and the Cyprus problem won't be solved. It is obvious that the real aim of GC leadership is to prison TC community to poverty and achieve its goal. The only aim of GC leadership is to take full control of Cyprus to satisfy their century aged Hellenic dreams.

Tell me Kifeas, if sale of GC lands is stopped, will GC leadership accept those two basic TC demands?

[Kifeas]

Gist of the problem is the "political equality" of two communities and the guarantorship of Turkey.

These are political issues and matters to be solved in the negotiations between the two communities and the three guarantor powers. The concept of political equality accepts many interpretations and can take several forms and shapes. There is no one single recipe of “political equality” and also the modern international democratic practices should be taken into consideration. It should be solved in a mutually acceptable to both sides, way. Also the issue of security must be examining in this scope and the new E.U. parameters.

We all know that GC leadership will never accept these two demands of TC community and the Cyprus problem won't be solved.

That is an absolutist approach. The way you go about it sound like an ultimatum issued by the TC community towards the GC side. "You either accept it in our way, or the Cyprus problem will not be solved." This is not the way political problems are solved. The right to ones property is not a political issue, anyway.

It is obvious that the real aim of GC leadership is to prison TC community to poverty and achieve its goal. The only aim of GC leadership is to take full control of Cyprus to satisfy their century aged Hellenic dreams.

Again you are back to the same monomaniac accusations and the same old clichés. You are soon going to surpass Denktash on this issue. You often accuse him of showing a “nerdly” attitude, but yours seems to be no better. I do not know why you do it. Is it because you are a pessimist by nature? Is it because you are fishing for excuses to promote your idea of partition? Is it because you are trying to victimise the opposite side, hoping that it will give up and accept your way of interpretation and your way of solution to the problem? I really do not know!

In case you have forgotten it, there is an even greater number of GCs, than the total number of TCs, who still suffer from the lack of a solution. There is a considerable number of GCs, up to 150,000, who continue for 30 years to be deprived of their property utilisation and income and who continue to remain in poverty, although the rest of south has Prospered. There is a huge number, up to 60,000 of GCs, who still live in refugee settlements of extremely poor quality, even worse than the housing conditions that many Turkish settlers in the north currently have. Is it the GC side’s wish to also keep them imprisoned and impoverished, like in the case of TCs that you mention? Accept it or not, the GC side is far more interested in a solution, the sooner the better, than any other party in the equation, including the TC community.

Tell me Kifeas, if sale of GC lands is stopped, will GC leadership accept those two basic TC demands?

You are equating the respect and protection of fundamental individual human rights, i.e. the right of respect to ones property, with the achievement of political goals, i.e. “political equality.” The Council of Europe’s convention for the protection of human rights and fundamental freedoms, clearly prohibits the restriction or denial, by any “authority” and on a massive scale, of the individual’s right to free access and enjoyment to his property, for the purpose and enforcement of any political strategy or the realisation of any political objective or solution. That is the basis on which the Loizidou case was founded and Turkey was condemned.

Insan, since you ask me about “political equality.” I would like you to address some issues that I posted on another threat.
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.php?p=18482#18482

If you can adequately answer GCs concerns as I described them and if you can also explain why the alternative formula that I suggested, cannot possibly be satisfactory to the TC community, then I will become the biggest advocate of political equality in this forum.

[insan]

Kifeas, the day you stop personalize the issues and insulting me with such words "monomaniac" we'll have a healthier discussion. I asked you what's your opinion about the issue, you told me what's your opinion about me. Now here's my conviction about you: You are a monomaniac, sneaky nerdish who try some tricks to achieve his goal with different methods. Actually you are no better than Tassos or the sneaky members of his team.

[Kifeas]

Kifeas, the day you stop personalize the issues and insulting me with such words "monomaniac" we'll have a healthier discussion.

I descriped the accusations that you make, not you as a person. It means one thing to say "you repeat the same monomaniac accusations" and means another thing to say "you are a monomaniac person." There is a lot of difference between the two. The first one referes to the particular behaviour on the particular issue, the second to the person itself, in a general and permanet sense. It is like you say to somebody that something he said is a lie, as opposed to saying to him that he is a lier.

Now here's my conviction about you: You are a monomaniac, sneaky nerdish who try some tricks to achieve his goal with different methods. Actually you are no better than Tassos or the sneaky members of his team.

I pass! Read my above explanation and compare it with what you just said about me as a person. I hope you understand what I mean.

[-mikkie2-]

Typical Insan response!

He gets offended easily! More egg shells being spread all over the place for Kifeas to avoid.

What does Kifeas mean by 'monomaniac'? The term means a person that is fixated on a single point of view. And you take offense to that?! What next?

I guess Insan took the word 'maniac' and assumed that he was being labelled as a loonatic or madman! Best to use simple english in this forum. Thats what happens when english is a 2nd language - people easily get the wrong impression.

[insan]

Typical Insan response!

He gets offended easily! More egg shells being spread all over the place for Kifeas to avoid.

What does Kifeas mean by 'monomaniac'? The term means a person that is fixated on a single point of view. And you take offense to that?! What next?

I guess Insan took the word 'maniac' and assumed that he was being labelled as a loonatic or madman! Best to use simple english in this forum. Thats what happens when english is a 2nd language - people easily get the wrong impression.

It's not only the word "monomaniac". His last post is full of insult. Kifeas's biggest mistake is to personalize the issues and use his convictions to attack to persons. But your nepotism has blinded you. You can't see the sneaky, nerdish aim of Kifeas. It seems you as a Brit national, haven't learned the difference between the meanings of the words "obsessional" and "monomaniac". Because you too have the same nerdish behaviours, mikkie.

[Kifeas]

Ok Insan, I promise to be more careful in the future, when I address something to you. I respect your sensitivity, although I do not think that my previous posting is anywhere near to what you describe it to have been. I am sure you were not looking for an excuse to refrain from answering my posting, and I will still be waiting for your comments.

[-mikkie2-]

Insan,

There you go again! Thanks for piling on the insults, but I don't take it personally and unlike you, I don't get offended. But if you expect me to keep quiet about what I think and what I believe then you are dealing with the wrong person.

Have a good day.

[insan]

Kifeas, as far as I understood you confuse the Cypriotness with Cypriotism. Therefore you base your arguments on cypriotism that does not exists in Cyprus.

Your arguments clearly give me the impression that you are a defender of Germany style reunification.
Did I misunderstand you?

- You want a mixed federal Cyprus based on Cypriotism. What does this mean? I think it is nothing else than a German style reunification. Where it leads us? I think nowhere else than a GC state with a Turkish minority. I don't think this is a concern of GC community. This is a belief of GC community based on some elements:

1- Being numerically more populated community.
2- Considering Cyprus a Hellen Island.

- You want no restrictions for return of refugees, right to property, right to settlement. Where does this lead us? Relocation of vast majority of TCs. Relocation of vast majority of TCs means a huge depression and sufferings; sociologically, economically, psychologically.

- TC community showed respect to concerns of GC community about this issue and agreed to relocation of 1/3 of TCs and gradual return of GC refugees up to %33 of permenant TC residents of TCCS. But you want no restriction is put to right to return of GC refugees. If I'm mistaken please correct me.

- TC community have concerns about GC leadership, GC extremists and GC self-interest groups. Therfore, they need a balance of powers in Cyprus which will provide security for two communities. TCs agreed gradual reduction of military power on both sides of Cyprus. But you want withdrawal of all Turkish troops. You have concerns about Turkey's interference in TC politics, we have concerns about Greece-GC common economical, strategical and political plans. We believe that the plans of Greece and GC leadership based upon interests of Hellenism will clash with the interests of TC community that is based on interests of majority of TC community. GC leadership has always freely worked with Greek government and established common strategies and policies in all areas. But you say you have concerns if TC community establishes such a strong relationship with Turkey. Please correct me if I'm wrong.