Cyprus-Forum.com

[purdey]

Oh yes I am, I was in one for nine years.The British army has had it's bad days as well.Cyprus is one,the Falklands,Iraq,Ireland.Do not believe all you read there are bastards in all armies...

[denizaksulu]

Purdey you are obviously not aware of how armies are run and organized. Nothing happens in a proper army without complicity of officers. If an officer does not want this men to loot rape and kill he has ways to do it. I am referring to events that happened after the cease fire not the invasion fighting itself.

You are implying that this rogue element exists in all armies. This is not borne out by the behavior of the British soldiers in Iraq,r Afghanista or the Falklands. The officers were there to make sure their men would behave like soldiers and not like maniacs. Those that do are court martialled.

The US army has investigated and court marialled several soldiers for crimes in Iraq. So obvously not all armies are the same. According to some, mostly in this forum, the Turkish army has a long tradition of honor and is supposed to be the best in NATO, better than the Americans and the British. So let us see them prove it.

There is no excuse for any barbarity.

It reminds me of an incident I was involved in in Izmir/Smyrna. I was with my wife who was wearing a crucifix around her neck. It was after 1974. We were in the market place. I did look like a tourist as one does. I was over 6 feet tall (just about), very unusual for a Pure Blood Turk. So when I began talking in perfect Turkish, I drew a crowd around me. The traders were asking me what part Turkey I was from. Some argued I could not be Turkish as I was as big as an 'izbandut'. (Izbandut gibi herif' is what they had said). I said I was Turkish Cypriot. One noticed the crucifix my wife was wearing and began asking questions, why was my wife wearing a crucifix while their brothers were dieing for us and all that. Why did I marry a 'gavur' and I saw more than a few knives come out. There were quite a few water-melon sellers around, so you can imagine the size of their knives.I had a hard time trying to convince them that my wife was not a 'gavur' when a few curious policemen came to our rescue after hearing the commotion. We learnt our lesson. Never again. At the time I pitied anyone coming across these people in any situation. If anything had hapenned, they would have bragged about it afterwards.

[Nikitas]

Deniz,

Some of those traders who threatened you most likely served their military service in Cyprus, and became heroes of the motherland "fighting" in Karpasia.

[zan]

The behavior of th Turkish army in the occupied areas is illustragted by the murder of the folk painter Kassialos. He was an old man in his 80s. He remained behind after the invasion and many weeks after the invasion a bunch of Turkish soldiers turned up at his house asking for money.

According to his wife this was a regular thing, soldiers often stopped by and extorted money from him. When he ran out of money they beat him to death. He was 89.

The TRNC regime said it was going to investigate the murder. We are still waiting to hear the results of their investigations.

If it happened to Kassialos it obviously happened to others. Done by soldiers who supposedly are the "best in NATO". Best at what? Extortion and murder or something else?

British soldiers killing and raping a girl only a few years ago

Masakis is mad....Are all GCs mad.......Come on man...You really are grasping at straws now....The individuals should be prosecuted...End of.

[Nikitas]

Grasping at straws! You mention one particular case you are described as clutching at straws, you mention numbers they bring up EOKA B as having killed thousands of GCs, you mention the events of Karpasia and they brazenly call you a liar. Are you people paid a salary by the Turkish army to defend their reputation?

Obviously the individuals involved in each and every case should be prosectued. None were.

In case you do not know, soldiers on active duty are prosecuted in military courts after the army in question decides to do something about it. The Turkish army has not done a thing about any of its soldiers who commited crimes against civilians in 1974. Which brings the question why not, and the obvious answer is because the soldiers were deliberately allowed to do these things. Negligence and carelessness are not defences for the so called "best in Nato" army or any other organised army.

[zan]

Grasping at straws! You mention one particular case you are described as clutching at straws, you mention numbers they bring up EOKA B as having killed thousands of GCs, you mention the events of Karpasia and they brazenly call you a liar. Are you people paid a salary by the Turkish army to defend their reputation?

Obviously the individuals involved in each and every case should be prosectued. None were.

In case you do not know, soldiers on active duty are prosecuted in military courts after the army in question decides to do something about it. The Turkish army has not done a thing about any of its soldiers who commited crimes against civilians in 1974. Which brings the question why not, and the obvious answer is because the soldiers were deliberately allowed to do these things. Negligence and carelessness are not defences for the so called "best in Nato" army or any other organised army.

My response is your accusations of all the Turkish army. There was a story, and I have no idea if it is true, perhaps Deniz can give us more of an insight, that the GCs cut off he penis of a downed pilot and stuck it in his mouth and then shot him and that is why the Turkish army started killing .

[Nikitas]

I am sure there are many stories like that. It has been said the 120 Greek commandos landed on Cyprus during the invasion played havoc with the mighty Turkish army and that inflamed their passions. This is all bullshit.

120 soldiers unsupported by armor or air power managed to do the things we have heard against 200 tanks and the hundreds of jets possessed by the Turkish armed forces in Cyprus! What were these dudes, supermen or they ingested vast amounts of vitamins!

There are no excuses for what happened. The lack of prosecutions or even arrests to stop the wrongdoers from carrying on what they were doing says a lot about the thinking behind the "peace operation".

There is a photograph of Androula Christodoulou aged 17 published in the Sunday Times of September 1974. She refused to submit to Turkish soldiers in Yalousa and she was bayoneted dozens of times. That was done in revenge for the pilot with the penis in his mouth! So let us excuse the people who did it. In which case let us excuse also the people who shot the family in the bathtub, and the killers of Sandalaris and Afania. They all had heard a story of some previous event that inflamed them no doubt.

[zan]

I am sure there are many stories like that. It has been said the 120 Greek commandos landed on Cyprus during the invasion played havoc with the mighty Turkish army and that inflamed their passions. This is all bullshit.

120 soldiers unsupported by armor or air power managed to do the things we have heard against 200 tanks and the hundreds of jets possessed by the Turkish armed forces in Cyprus! What were these dudes, supermen or they ingested vast amounts of vitamins!

There are no excuses for what happened. The lack of prosecutions or even arrests to stop the wrongdoers from carrying on what they were doing says a lot about the thinking behind the "peace operation".

There is a photograph of Androula Christodoulou aged 17 published in the Sunday Times of September 1974. She refused to submit to Turkish soldiers in Yalousa and she was bayoneted dozens of times. That was done in revenge for the pilot with the penis in his mouth! So let us excuse the people who did it. In which case let us excuse also the people who shot the family in the bathtub, and the killers of Sandalaris and Afania. They all had heard a story of some previous event that inflamed them no doubt.

I am trying to get a balance on your extreme comments Nikitas not excuse anyone........The only excuse I can give anyone in war is temporary madness.

[umit07]

Boomerang you wanted english articles about missing people these two are by Sevgül uludağ:

http://www.stwing.upenn.edu/~durduran/hamambocu/authors/svg/svg0_9_2005.html

http://www.stwing.upenn.edu/~durduran/hamambocu/authors/svg/svg0_16_2005.html

I may not support her political views but, I do support her work on trying to uncover the history of both GC's and TC's killed by whoever.

[boomerang]

Boomerang you wanted english articles about missing people these two are by Sevgül uludağ:

http://www.stwing.upenn.edu/~durduran/hamambocu/authors/svg/svg0_9_2005.html

http://www.stwing.upenn.edu/~durduran/hamambocu/authors/svg/svg0_16_2005.html

I may not support her political views but, I do support her work on trying to uncover the history of both GC's and TC's killed by whoever.

goodonya mate...I will look at these sources a little later