Cyprus-Forum.com

[CopperLine]

A crime is a crime irrespective of the length of time past

Not necessarily. First, there are all sorts of crimes in all sorts of legal systems which for which an equivalent of a 'statute of limitation' applies. Statutes of limitations have applied in many truly horrendous crimes. Second, crimes committed by certain state officials, eg government executives such as heads of state, presidents, etc have historically been immune to prosecution. It is only recently that immunity from criminal proceedings is very slowly and gradually beginning to be lifted.

[phoenix]

A crime is a crime irrespective of the length of time past

Not necessarily. First, there are all sorts of crimes in all sorts of legal systems which for which an equivalent of a 'statute of limitation' applies. Statutes of limitations have applied in many truly horrendous crimes. Second, crimes committed by certain state officials, eg government executives such as heads of state, presidents, etc have historically been immune to prosecution. It is only recently that immunity from criminal proceedings is very slowly and gradually beginning to be lifted.

I disagree with you . . . and clearly, so does the ECHR.

[yiannisP]

It could only happen in Cyprus. 30+ years after the event taking cases to the ECHR. Such hatred!

There has not been justice and Turkey have been the main party in frustrating this. What do you expect people to do, forget about their missing relatives? It is not hatred it's justice for crimes.

Can you imagine what would have happened if there had been an ECHR in the 1970s and other nationalities had taken Germany to court after their actions in the last war? There would not have been enough judges in the world to hear the cases.

I fail to see how this is relevant. Crimes have been committed. Whether there are enough people to hear the cases is irrelevant from this point of view.

Perhaps the 'forgiveness gene' is missing from Cypriots'. Now that GCs are in the EU surely it is time to act like decent Europeans and forgive and forget after all the EU will hopefully lead to all being one nation one day with no more wars.

It is very difficult to forgive someone who is not in the least bit sorry, especially over something as severe as murder. Perhaps after justice there can be forgiveness? If there is no justice then how can we stop hurting each other? I'm not optimistic on these European cases as I think Turkey still has amnesia over whether they killed 1 million+ Armenians near the beginning of last century. What effect is a fraction of those deaths in the case of Cyprus going to have on people so cold?

The way I look at Turkey's justification for invading Cyprus as a young GC Brit is very similar to the reason given for invading Iraq. There were no WMDs of course, and Turkey didn't invade specifically to protect TCs imo. I don't think any government in the world is so altruistic, so I'll settle on the historically safe category of 'military reasons'

[CopperLine]

I disagree with you . . . and clearly, so does the ECHR.

Phoenix, me dear, you really are mad as plantpot. You are the 'whack-a-rat' queen.

How can the ECHR disagree with me ? They've never heard of me. I haven't expressed as view as to whether statutes of limitation or immunity from prosecution are good or bad or anything else.

Statutes of limitation ? you might not like them, I might not like them, the ECHR might rule against/in support/applicable/inapplicable, but they exist.
Immunity from prosecution ? you might not like them, I might not like them, the ECHR might rule against/in support/applicable/inapplicable, but they exist.

Phoenix you really should stop making things up.

[boomerang]

copperline...a brief summary...

1...6 judges - guilty
2...1 judge - not guilty.

explain the following
How do you explain 6 judges after reviewing the case found turkey guilty and one not, a TC appointed judge...Coincidense or Expectation?

I mean how could 6 judges have gotten it so wrong?...and one not, and appointed by the state that his is ruling on...

This should start ringing alarm bells in my books, and it means shit what his views are...

[Filitsa]

ECHR finds Turkey guilty of human rights violation

10/01/2008

The European Court of Human Rights has found Turkey guilty of violating the human rights of Greek Cypriots, missing since the 1974 Turkish invasion of Cyprus. In its judgment the Court said Turkey is guilt of “the continuing violation of Article 2 of the European Convention on Human Rights on account of failure of the authorities of the respondent state (Turkey) to conduct an effective investigation into the whereabouts and fate of the nine first applicants who disappeared in life threatening circumstances”.
The decision, in the case of “Varnava and Others v. Turkey”, was taken by six votes in favour and one against, that of judge Gonu Eronen, representing Turkey.
The Court also announced that there was violation of Article 3 which prohibits inhuman treatment and Article 5 (right to liberty and security).
The applicants are 18 Cypriot nationals, nine of whom have been considered missing since they were taken into captivity by the Turkish army during military action in Cyprus in 1974. They have not been accounted for since.
The other nine applicants are the parents or wives of the missing applicants and based their application on Articles 2 (right to life), 3 (prohibition of inhuman or degrading treatment), 4 (prohibition of forced labour), 5 (right to liberty and security), 6 (right to a fair trial), 8 (right to respect for private and family life), 10 (freedom of expression), 12 (right to marry), 13 (right to an effective remedy) and 14 (prohibition of discrimination) of the European Convention.

http://www.financialmirror.com/more_new ... t=Politics


Gcs prisoners at Adana prison. Some of them are still missing.
Turkey never gave information regarding their fate.

This, and Bush is proclaiming Turkey the paradigm of democracy for Islamic nations.

[Nikitas]

Guys,

No surprise that the lady presented the only dissenting judgment. This the way these things work out and that is why every state is allowed to have itw own judge on the panel in almost every single international jidicial body.

What is missing in the responses of VP and Deniz is any consideration that this was not the much touted "peace operation". It has repeatedly been shown at this and other objective venues to have been anything but a peace operation. The events that transpired came after the total and unchallenged military victory of Turkey in Cyprus. THis was an organized and disciplined army wea re talking about here, much touted as the best and largest in NATO, that carried out these acts. Precisely because it is organized and disciplined these acts can only be construed as a deliberate policy to terrorise and expel the population of northern Cyprus.

Let me put it another way so there is not tit for tat nonsense. In August 1974 Turkey did on a national scale and with horrific efficiency what the GC fantatic irregulars did in 1963 on a local scale. The events of August and September 1974 in Karpasia will haunt Turkey for a long time. Murder has no statute of limitations.

[kafenes]

copperline...a brief summary...

1...6 judges - guilty
2...1 judge - not guilty.

explain the following
How do you explain 6 judges after reviewing the case found turkey guilty and one not, a TC appointed judge...Coincidense or Expectation?

I mean how could 6 judges have gotten it so wrong?...and one not, and appointed by the state that his is ruling on...

This should start ringing alarm bells in my books, and it means shit what his views are...

Because Boom, if that judge had voted guilty, it would be one dead judge today.

[phoenix]

I disagree with you . . . and clearly, so does the ECHR.

Phoenix, me dear, you really are mad as plantpot. You are the 'whack-a-rat' queen.

How can the ECHR disagree with me ? They've never heard of me. I haven't expressed as view as to whether statutes of limitation or immunity from prosecution are good or bad or anything else.

Statutes of limitation ? you might not like them, I might not like them, the ECHR might rule against/in support/applicable/inapplicable, but they exist.
Immunity from prosecution ? you might not like them, I might not like them, the ECHR might rule against/in support/applicable/inapplicable, but they exist.

Phoenix you really should stop making things up.

I mistook you for someone less dense . . .

[boomerang]

copperline...a brief summary...

1...6 judges - guilty
2...1 judge - not guilty.

explain the following
How do you explain 6 judges after reviewing the case found turkey guilty and one not, a TC appointed judge...Coincidense or Expectation?

I mean how could 6 judges have gotten it so wrong?...and one not, and appointed by the state that his is ruling on...

This should start ringing alarm bells in my books, and it means shit what his views are...

Because Boom, if that judge had voted guilty, it would be one dead judge today.

You mean stuck between a rock and a hard on?...and it looks like he chose the hard on...