Cyprus-Forum.com

[cymart]

If you have been born somewhere and lived there for over 30 years,it would be most likely you could claim the right of residency on humanitarian grouds,regardless of how and why your parents first came there etc.I can cite the personal example of the people from Turkey who have occupied the family home of my father-in-law in the Karpas since 1976.We know them after visiting many times and I first met them in 1981 when I was allowed over to the north as a foreigner.They have children and now grand children who were born there and consider it their home,yet their parents told us in early 2004 that they were prepared to go back to Turkey if they received the 10.000 euros compensation per family which was then being discussed.But since this side rejected the Annan Plan,they consider they will be staying and have built extensions to the house and spent money on renovations etc.They are always polite but have made it quite clear that we can now forget any idea of us going back to live there ourselves,not that we planned to anyway...
I wonder how supporters of the idea of waiting for things to improve for our side can answer this rather obvious reality???

[Nikitas]

It is not up to them to decide. Their move to Cyprus and occupation of your home is all part of an international crime banned by the UN charter and all conventions on human rights. Their only hope of legalisation is a political settlement. How much does it take for you to understand this Cymart?

Whichever way you slice it, with or without recognition of the north, with or without the EU, the property rights of the individuals who lawfully own the land cannot be extinguished. That is the reason the TRNC does not accept full entry into the EU, because it would have to apply EU laws and that will mean restitution of properties.

People here have made much of the Kosovo situation and its similarities to Cyprus. Well, they should look again at the guarantees the proposals for Kossovo for land rights and ownership. And the parallel efforts made by the Kossovars to guarantee properties of the non Albanians.

[CopperLine]

Nikitas,
As I read your words -

Their move to Cyprus and occupation of your home is all part of an international crime

- there are at least three alternative implication of what you have said.

First, you might mean that someone, of whatever origin including Cypriot, who moved to Cyprus and bought and occupied any property in the north would be complicit in an international crime.

Second, you might mean that someone, of whatever origin including Cypriot, who moved to Cyprus and bought and occupied a Greek Cypriot title property in the north would be complicit in an international crime.

Third, you might mean that someone, of whatever origin including Cypriot, who moved to Cyprus and bought and occupied any property in the north or south would be complicit in an international crime.


The reason I ask this question is that, if individual property claims are to be resolved first or comprehensively before any general peace plan can be implemented then that might make an argument for putting all our efforts into private cases and to put efforts for a public peace on the backburner. If anyone and everyone who comes to Cyprus, north or south, then becomes complicit in an international crime then the pursuit of individual cases would take forever, wouldn't it ?

[pantheman]

Nikitas,
As I read your words -

Their move to Cyprus and occupation of your home is all part of an international crime

- there are at least three alternative implication of what you have said.

First, you might mean that someone, of whatever origin including Cypriot, who moved to Cyprus and bought and occupied any property in the north would be complicit in an international crime.

Second, you might mean that someone, of whatever origin including Cypriot, who moved to Cyprus and bought and occupied a Greek Cypriot title property in the north would be complicit in an international crime.

Third, you might mean that someone, of whatever origin including Cypriot, who moved to Cyprus and bought and occupied any property in the north or south would be complicit in an international crime.


The reason I ask this question is that, if individual property claims are to be resolved first or comprehensively before any general peace plan can be implemented then that might make an argument for putting all our efforts into private cases and to put efforts for a public peace on the backburner. If anyone and everyone who comes to Cyprus, north or south, then becomes complicit in an international crime then the pursuit of individual cases would take forever, wouldn't it ?

Copperline, here is a question for you too then.

Are you actually saying (as in alternative three) that it is illegal to move to the south and buy property?

Because i think that is what you are inferring here.

The RoC (south to you turks) is a legitimate state/government and cannot be compared to the illegally held north. Or have I completely misunderstood you?

Nikitas was obviously refering to moving to the north taking other peoples property, but to a turk that wouldn't make a difference i guess, would it?

But you know that anyway, don't you?

[CopperLine]

Pantheman,
I can't be bothered with your sarcasm or with your constantly rash assumptions about me or my intentions.

[pantheman]

Pantheman,
I can't be bothered with your sarcasm or with your constantly rash assumptions about me or my intentions.

I don't care if you could be bothered or not, because i won't let you keep putting down the GC side by supporting the illegalities of the other side.


Your inadmission to date of your true nationality or intentions, leaves me no uncertainty, that for you to keep on speaking the way that you do, you can only be of turkish origin or are funded by some other body to spread your trash.

To date, you have always biased to the turkish side, without ANY balance, and i won't let you do that however clever you think you are. I will be onto you like a rash. Deal with it.

I asked you a simple question, you still haven't answered it. Please answer the question above. Any profanity and you will get it all back mate.

Have a nice day, keep one eye over your shoulder.

[boomerang]

for an intellectual you sure are excibiting stupidness...or is it arrogance copperline?

PS...even to a dumb fuck like me, what Nikitas is saying is pretty clear what he meant...and if I am a dumb fuck, what does that make you?

[DINOS SKALIOTIS]

Pantheman,
I can't be bothered with your sarcasm or with your constantly rash assumptions about me or my intentions.

what a loser! i feel embarrassed for you

[Nikitas]

Copperline,

Since the end of WWII there are two principles of international law that are more or less universally applied and accepted. The first is that there can be no territorial gain via war, and the second is that coloniszation of occupied land is a crime. This is the crime I was referring to and it has been taking place in northern Cyprus since Turkey started implementing its policy of colonization.

People (third country nationals) who buy property GC in the north are complicit in other types of legal wrongs but not in the colonization.

The major force behind the colonization is some sick person or persons in Ankara who think that long term they can upset the demographic map of Cyprus and arrive at a time when they can point to a new proportion and not the old 82-18. Considering that major powers like UK, USA, Russia and France have daily contacts in the TRNC and their intelligence agencies are roaming around the place, one must conclude that they know this is going on. So does the EU naturally.

The fact that they say nothing about the colonization proves, to me at least, that they are behaving like pimps. And I say this not because I am angry, which I am, but because the conclusion of this policy cannot be anything other than a new armed conflict which will be worse than anything we have seen so far. In the past we had quick conflicts because the combatants were vastly unequal. In this next one the force parity will make the destruction much worse.

As to a possible solution and how it will affect the property issue. It all depends on whether it leaves any major section of the population feeling cheated or disgruntled. It will be quite hard to accept a solution which rewards settlers but leaves, for example, expatriated Cypriots and other real stakeholders who are landless. I for one would challenge such a solution in court. Just for the hell of it. On the basis of the principle of equality I think I will have a case.

[boomerang]

toutos mono troe fasolada tzie portizi re nikita