Cyprus-Forum.com

[turkcyp]

deleted by the author...

[insan]

When Denktash claimed that the GCs would voye "yes" to plan, some polls made in south indicated that %62 of GC would vote "yes" to the plan. Actually Denktash had some valid concerns that in the long term TCs would become a minority in Cyprus if no permanent derogations has been put on freedom of movement. His other concern was "sulandırılmış" guarantorship. And he surely claimed that EU will never accept Turkey's membership.

Don't forget that he was aware of that the GC leadership based the solution of Cyprus problem on a "European Solution" back in 1987 when they applied to EU membership and rejected both the early draft of Annan Plan which was proposed in 1987 and the "set of ideas" in 1994 because of the "European Solution".

Furthermore I don't agree with you that Denktash devoted his life for partition. I well examined his views and attitudes regarding Cyprus issue. His negative stance towards a solution mostly arouse from GC itransigence. Particularly the negative stance of Kyprianou, the successor of Makarios.

My only negative thought about Denktash is that his nerdily behaviors and ineffectiveness, incapability to expose the intentions of GC leadership. His nerdily behaviours, ineffectiveness and incapability caused TCs to lost many things.

[Deejay]

No kidding. Then I suppose now you will claim Greece, Bulgaria, Romania, Yugoslavia, middle east etc.

No this is where you are wrong. We are not an expansionist country.
"We do not want an inch of another nations land, but yet we are not willing to give an inch of ours!" (Mustafa Kemal Ataturk)

I suggest you read about the agreement that the Ottoman empire had with the British Empire about Cyprus. Cyprus was loaned to the British Empire in exchange for assistance against the Russians and the Greeks who were interestingly trying to claim Anatolia. This loan was similar to the one of Hong Kong from China to the British (Subsequently the British again!)

The Ottoman Empire did not formally agree to cede Cyprus to another nation. The Republic of Turkey agreed to give the islands to Greece, and Mosul, Kerkuk to the British. This is fair enough. The Turkish Republic did not agree to give Cyprus to anybody else. This is the difference Piratis

Invading and occupying some land for a period of time doesn't make it yours. It takes a lot more than that. Like for example creating civilization and culture in that area. Do you know what these 2 words mean? Check out here: www.dictionary.com

The invasion started in the 1950s when mainland Greek troops (with the spirit of ENOSIS) came across to Cyprus dressed in civilian clothing to combat the British and stir trouble. http://www.britains-smallwars.com/cyprus/

The invasion had began well before Turkey came to Cyprus...Greece beat Turkey to it!!

It is unhered? Maybe by you. I suggest you study a bit more history. Start with World War II.

30 odd years have paased, and I havent seen the Sth Cyprus Greek Governments decision influencing Nth Cyprus. We will not see it either. There is 2 governments and 2 individual governments on the island of Cyprus. One being Greek, the other Turkish.

Can you point to me the countries you refer to?

My country is Cyprus my friend. You have a misconception of what I am saying. I am not saying let's rip North Cyprus away from the island and annex it to Turkey. I am saying that there is 2 different states within a framework of Cyprus eg like Belgium, and Timor. This is a reality.[/quote]

[Piratis]

The Ottoman Empire did not formally agree to cede Cyprus to another nation.

We, that have been in Cyprus 3000 years before the Ottomans, have not agreed to cede Cyprus to anybody. Cyprus belongs to Cypriots (82% of which are GCs) and not to an empire that does not exist.

30 odd years have paased

30 years of occupation. For how long did your Ottoman empire occupy those other places? This didn't stop those nations from getting liberated one day, right?

I am saying that there is 2 different states within a framework of Cyprus eg like Belgium, and Timor. This is a reality

Well, the 2 states that you talk about exist only in your dreams and in now void and null partition plans.
In reality what it exists is RoC, part of which is illegally occupied by Turkey.

[garbitsch]

In reality what it exists is RoC, part of which is illegally occupied by Turkey - in order to stop the Greek invasion of Cyprus and extermination of the whole Turkish Cypriot community. Are you going to deny this aswell??

[Piratis]

the Greek invasion

It was an illegal coup, not an invasion.

extermination of the whole Turkish Cypriot community

This is your theoretical claim. Not a fact.

in order to

In order to partition Cyprus. If what they wanted was to stop the illegal coup, then they would restore democracy in RoC, not occupy 1/3rd of it for 30 years.

[garbitsch]

It was a coup which aimed at unifying Cyprus with Greece - this is called invasion and annexation of Cyprus by Greece.

Extermination: Go and read Akritas plan (some GCs in this forum admit that)

You are partial right about Turkey's existence in Cyprus. I agree with that.

[insan]

In order to partition Cyprus. If what they wanted was to stop the illegal coup, then they would restore democracy in RoC, not occupy 1/3rd of it for 30 years.

On which RoC Turkey would restore constitutional order?

a) Original RoC constitution that GC Hellenic Ruling Elite tried to get rid of?

b) 13 points of Makarios?

3) Counter proposals of Turkish Ruling Elite?

Which one you would prefer, Piratis?

[Piratis]

It was a coup which aimed at unifying Cyprus with Greece

It was an illegal coup, and what was aiming was illegal as well. This illegal coup did not have the support of the majority of GCs. If Turkey instead of occupying part of Cyprus was stopping the coup, then we would both celebrate that day.

Extermination: Go and read Akritas plan (some GCs in this forum admit that)

Akritas plan is a document. Not a reality. It was not something known (let alone supported) by the majority of GCs.
The implementation of your "Akritas plan" is a fact though. 200.000 refugees and ethnic cleansing of 1/3rd of Cyprus.

[Piratis]

On which RoC Turkey would restore constitutional order?

To the original 1960 agreements.

The 13 points were proposals, and then we had intercomunal violent conflict (for which I will not deny that GCs were mostly responsible).

This is why Turkey is a guarantor of RoC. To guarantee that it will function as it should, not to brake it apart.