Cyprus-Forum.com

[insan]

This is what they have said last year when TRNC set up the property commission. Last time I heard there were more than 1000 applications from GCs.

But anyway, there is only way to find out right?

Sure there will be a group of GC refugees who wishes to exchange their properties but most of the Kyrenian and Karpasian refugees will reject to apply to this commission because I know most of them wishes to return their ancestral homes and get their lands back. I'm sure while you are offering them only either to exchange or get the compensation of their properties, they will apply to ECHR to both get the compensation of loss of use and right to return.

Why returning 9% of the land in Annan Plan in three years is feasible but it would take 20 years to return %18. In five years it can be done.

Returning %9 of occupied territory to GC administration is one thing; gradual return of properties to GC refugees is another thing. After the land given back to GC administration all TCs inhabit in that territory will be forced to abandon the territory. It is said that there are currently 60-70 thousands TCs inhabit in that territory. I don't think either "TRNC" or Turkey can financially manage to rehabilitate 60-70 thousands TCs in 5 years time.

We can not negotiate forever till the GCs compromise, especially now that it is obvious that they think they are in EU so they can get a better deal and will reject anything sensible.

Ok. the only way to put a full stop to this fruitless negotiations is that we should unilatterally declare that we don't want to negotiate reunification of Cyprus anymore. Following this, we should propose our partition plan and ask international community to back our proposal for a fair partition. Of course we should base our proposal on valid arguments and rationales.

In my opinion this is the most feasible and rational way to put a full stop to this neverending story.

[erolz]

Are you kidding? You think GC's are going to pay money for properties they already own? What kind of delusional rubbish is that.

No but I think there are some GC that would buy property they do not already own - maybe only former non GC owned properties pre 74 perhaps or maybe not. Not everyone see thw world / Cyprus problem as you / we do.

[erolz]

I'd like to hear your judgment about the rightness and rationality of selling the occupied GC properties to their owners or other non-refugee GCs.

Sorry I did not make myself very clear. I was making no assertions as to the rightness or rationality - I just meant he is right imo in thinking there would be some GC that would consider purchasing land in the North if they could do so. There are many 'rumours' of GC having already done this through various 'fronts' (as well as investing in businesses in the north). They may be just that - rumours by my personal belief is that some GC would be prepared to buy and or invest in the north even without a settlement. It may not be right or rational.

[turkcyp]

deleted by the author...

[insan]

But that is what I have suggested. Do you think without giving substantial amount of land back, whatever we offer will be deemed rational. In any partition we either give up all the land we occupy more than we deserve, or we do not but agree to accept many GCs into TRNC with full rights.

What you suggested didn't seem to me that was what you suggested.


First of all the acceptablity and feasibility of partition should be well examined and asked openly and formaly in front of international community.

For instance, Talat or Turkey or whomever you wish to be; should visit all EU countries, US etc to consult/discuss the partition and get their reactions, opinions about it. If whole world or mostly they oppose such a partition, why should you waste your time to do all the things you have mentioned above. Otherwise you'll face a great disaster both in "TRNC" and international arena.

[insan]

I understand your concerns. It's survival issue again. TCs need to survive so I can understand why a TC who left a substantial land in the south might feel that he owns the GC land given to him in the north. But we know that this is not always the case. There're many cases where settlers sell land or some TC who didn't have anything in the south sell land in the north. Do you see anyone saying anything about these? You said you're against settlers selling land, well, doesn't it at least bother you to see that it's actually happenning?

metecyp, as far as I know foreigners don't buy property or land that does not have an equivelant in South. And the relevant ministry department is so careful about this issues. Because they all know that one day the responsibles of irregularities will be caled to account for the irregularities he/she is responsible for. Selling property to foreigners is subjected to the permission of Ministry of internal affairs. No one can sell any land without the permission of ministry of internal affairs.

Settlers can sell the properties they occupy only to the other settlers that are citizens of "TRNC". This should be prohibitted.

Secondly, we say we accept the Annan plan. That means we're ready to accept a significant number of GCs to the north. Then, as soon as the Annan plan is down, we start filling empty GC land in the north with properties, hoping that the property will be valued higher than the land and it'll be given to a TC rather than its original GC owner. Does this sound sincere to you? Does this help for unification at all? I don't think so.

These are rumours. Talat stated that there's no such thing. The construction works which were suspended during the negotiations turn to its normal progression. Besides the construction projects that were made long before the negotiations put into implementation.

Moreover, the properties issue is intentionally exaggerated in order to create such impressions to force Tassos back to table with his proposals.

And finally, what about GC losses? I know TCs lost a lot in the last 30-40 years. My grandfather lost 1 shop and 2 flats in 1963. He lost another shop in 1974. So I know what you're talking about. But does this mean that I can go and grab an innocent GC's land in the north and claim that it's mine since my grandfather lost so much?

metecyp, to be obliged to sell a property or some land is one thing what you say is another thing. Regarding the losses of two sides. Yes it is huge. But here's an example for you to see the injusticeness.

Giorgios left one restaurant in Kyrenia and given a TC restaurant in Larnaca which belongs to a TC. Mustafa who left a restaurant in Larnaca given a GC restaurant in Kyrenia.

The Giorgio's restaurant in Larnaka has been visited by 3 million tourists in 30 years time and paid Giorgios 100 billion pounds. On the other hand Mustafa's restaurant in Kyrenia has been visited by 100.000 tourists in 30 years time and paid him 1 billion pounds. What is the loss of Mustafa and what is the loss of Giorgios?

I don't think so but the same time, I can't wait another 40 years for property issue to be solved. It's a delicate issue and there's no right or wrong answer. I don't feel right building my future on a disputed land but at the same time, I can't waste all my life in limbo and not get anything accomplished

.

I'm telling you metecyp. If no embargos has been imposed upon TCs and the voluntary exchange of properties agreement has been signed; there wouldn't have been such meaningless problems even if the Cyprus problem hasn't been solved.


Every wrong has its cost. All of us paying the bill of our own, other's and common mistakes.

[boulio]

Giorgios left one restaurant in Kyrenia and given a TC restaurant in Larnaca which belongs to a TC. Mustafa who left a restaurant in Larnaca given a GC restaurant in Kyrenia.


WHY DONT you ask giorgios and mustafa when was the last time they visited there parents graves in larnaca and kyrenia,its not about the rest.or the money there are many other things attached to a piece of land.sometimes i wonder if both sides really understand that.

[insan]

Giorgios left one restaurant in Kyrenia and given a TC restaurant in Larnaca which belongs to a TC. Mustafa who left a restaurant in Larnaca given a GC restaurant in Kyrenia.


WHY DONT you ask giorgios and mustafa when was the last time they visited there parents graves in larnaca and kyrenia,its not about the rest.or the money there are many other things attached to a piece of land.sometimes i wonder if both sides really understand that.

Create another topic for other things you want to discuss or make people to understand. Ok?

[boulio]

no its not okay,why dont you ask giorgios and mustafa that,did i torpedo your little idiotic example?

[insan]

no its not okay,why dont you ask giorgios and mustafa that,did i torpedo your little idiotic example?

You idiot when will you learn respect to others and not to twist the words of others for your idiotic ideas?