Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

The UK is a heavily industrial society Zan, it obviously needed a long time to adjust to EU standards and practices. The Turkish Cypriot community is essentially a farming/service oriented economy and it can adapt to EU practices pretty fast, assuming its leaders let it adapt.

The strains of being right next door to an EU economy are beginning to show now. I lived a similar time in Greece before it beacme a full member of the EU and we had to go through a weird and humiliating process when travelling to Italy. Search on the way out to make sure you were not carrying foreign currency or valuable assets*, search on the way in to check that you were not bringing in contraband. It was all bureaucratic bullshit which never worked.

In the end it all vanished when Greece became a full member of the EU and it was finally buried when we got the Euro and stopped that foreign exchange control crap.

The sooner the Turkish Cypriot leadership espoused full EU standards and wasy of doing things the better it will be for everyone.

* Valuable assets were interpreted by one customs man in Piraeus to include bags of lentils and dried fasolia because "they could be sold overseas" and thus be the means to circumvent exchange controls!!!! If it had not happened to me I would not believe it!

You are not just looking at Cyprus but the whole of the EU and the whole thing is in its infancy. We are so insular still that we do not even know why the changes are being made locally when the real reason could be because of conditions in the other corner. The EU clock ticks the same.

[Nikitas]

Zan,

I have been living in Greece since before they entered the EU. The fears expressed back then were similar to what I hear from Cyprus and Cypriots today. Once in, and under the partial command of Brussels, there are things that have to happen, which would have happened anyway, and they do happen.

An example, all forward thinking countries must keep a certain standard in education. The EU forces all members to stay at a minimum standard and this is getting higher all the time. Left to its own devices Greece would reach that standard, ten or twenty years later than it has done.

The country has not become like Sweden overnight, but it got where it is faster than it would have done. The same is happening to Cyprus, although with a lot less griping than there was in Greece.

As for the future, well it is as unknown for the other 26 member states as it is for us. But it is good for places like Cyprus to be kicked in the ass (friendly like) now and again to get a move on. Wish we could do it on our own, but the koumbaros network is a powerful counter incentive.

[Kikapu]

utu how long can you try to ignore snide remarks and insults, there comes a time like in 1974 when you have to stand up for what you believe in and fight back.

Like what happened with Expatkiwi? For his pro-independence stance for the north, he ended up getting more than just snide remarks and insults. He faced a direct threat to himself and his family. Not exactly what one expects from a forum.

utu I have faced the same barrage of insults and accusations from GCs and TCs who cannot see or accept that there is different viewpoints on solving the Cyprus problem, they live in some sort of utopia (mostly abroad) and try to dictate to us that we are wrong and what is best for our future. Well what I suggest to those people are firstly return to Cyprus north or south and then decide with more insight to what actually goes on here, see first hand that neither side has any intention of solving jack shit because they lack vision, understanding or courage to compromise in order to find a solution. The opposite to unification is agreed partition which is not as bad as people try to make out it is, we are 90% of the way there anyway.

Since you are so smart and most TC living in the UK and the "TRNC" wants Partition, why have you not proposed to take the 18% and be done with it. You know by now, that the RoC is not going to give you more or allow any formal recognition to the North, so why are you waiting. Why doesn't Talat make a proposal to PapaD and make an even break. Hell, PapaD might even round it up to 20% if you asked nicely. You tell us it's about controlling your own destiny and keeping stolen land is not your aim, then make the proposal. Then you can have whom ever you wished in your "country". As soon as the deal is signed, Kifeas and his crew will start building the 20ft wall for once and for good. From then on, you will be on your own, in bed with Turkey or whom ever, will be your choice entirely. So simple, make the request and see what happens. You are now talking about an "Agreed Partition", since you have given up on the "Forced Partition" because no one is willing to help you get it, and rather than be seen as " Pirates of the Mediterranean", it will do you good to do something honest for a change.

[zan]

utu how long can you try to ignore snide remarks and insults, there comes a time like in 1974 when you have to stand up for what you believe in and fight back.

Like what happened with Expatkiwi? For his pro-independence stance for the north, he ended up getting more than just snide remarks and insults. He faced a direct threat to himself and his family. Not exactly what one expects from a forum.

utu I have faced the same barrage of insults and accusations from GCs and TCs who cannot see or accept that there is different viewpoints on solving the Cyprus problem, they live in some sort of utopia (mostly abroad) and try to dictate to us that we are wrong and what is best for our future. Well what I suggest to those people are firstly return to Cyprus north or south and then decide with more insight to what actually goes on here, see first hand that neither side has any intention of solving jack shit because they lack vision, understanding or courage to compromise in order to find a solution. The opposite to unification is agreed partition which is not as bad as people try to make out it is, we are 90% of the way there anyway.

Since you are so smart and most TC living in the UK and the "TRNC" wants Partition, why have you not proposed to take the 18% and be done with it. You know by now, that the RoC is not going to give you more or allow any formal recognition to the North, so why are you waiting. Why doesn't Talat make a proposal to PapaD and make an even break. Hell, PapaD might even round it up to 20% if you asked nicely. You tell us it's about controlling your own destiny and keeping stolen land is not your aim, then make the proposal. Then you can have whom ever you wished in your "country". As soon as the deal is signed, Kifeas and his crew will start building the 20ft wall for once and for good. From then on, you will be on your own, in bed with Turkey or whom ever, will be your choice entirely. So simple, make the request and see what happens. You are now talking about an "Agreed Partition", since you have given up on the "Forced Partition" because no one is willing to help you get it, and rather than be seen as " Pirates of the Mediterranean", it will do you good to do something honest for a change.

I've changed my mind...If you are not Greek then I will eat your boat...If you've really got one that is.....We are not asking anymore big boy..We are demanding our rights.....The day that you voted OXI to the Annan Plan we woke up. No more sleeping.

[Kikapu]

latest polls are:
According to a recent poll conducted by the self-declared Turkish Republic of North Cyprus, 60 per cent of Turkish Cypriots now favour a two-state solution that would see their population permanently separated from their Greek counterparts on the south of the island along the infamous Green Line border that carves the island in two.


http://news.independent.co.uk/europe/article3218049.ece

It all depends who actually voted. In actuality, I'm surprised that the number were not higher, much higher in fact, considering settlers who were "converted" to become Turkish Cypriots stands to lose the most except for a 2 Independent State solution, where they get to keep GC properties for free. So let us be generous and remove 25% of the "settlers factor" and you have about 35% True Turkish Cypriots who had voted in this poll. In 2004 Referendum, the "TRNC" voted 65% on the AP, which many GC's saw it as a Partition Plan at the expense of the RoC, which the TC's had everything to gain and very little to lose. So in actuality, the percentages has gone down from 65% in 2004 to 60% now, and if you remove the 25% "settlers factor", it is down to even lower numbers, which is 35%. The real differential numbers from 2004 to 2007 are 30% less True TC's wanting partition or 2 Independent state solution than they did in 2004. Could it be, that majority of the TC's fear being ruled by Ankara, once they achieve an Independent State .???

I think this new poll is actually works against the "TRNC" and the Partitionist wanting a Partition or a 2 Independent State Solution. The reported was also very much reporting what he was fed by the "TRNC" and not having his own information. I mean, how many partitionist really agree with this

"Turkish Cypriots have started to say if they don't want a solution with us, if they don't want to live with us why should we continue to ask to live together, what is the point? A growing number of Turkish Cypriot's are thinking this every day. The walls between the two peoples are growing taller every day."

Since when did the 200,000 GC refugees been offered to come and live in their properties in the "TRNC" in order to make the above claim.

You still have not countered these numbers Miss Piggy. What's the matter, are you afraid that the Partition is not what the True TC want or what.???

[zan]

There you go with the uneducated 200,000 refugee claim straight out of the GC propaganda book.....Happy reading my friend.

[Kikapu]

There you go with the uneducated 200,000 refugee claim straight out of the GC propaganda book.....Happy reading my friend.

199,999. Happy Now.

If not, then you can tell us which numbers will make it easier for you to sleep at night.

[zan]

There you go with the uneducated 200,000 refugee claim straight out of the GC propaganda book.....Happy reading my friend.

199,999. Happy Now.

If not, then you can tell us which numbers will make it easier for you to sleep at night.

What I would like is for you to educate yourself on facts and not take the GC party line of propaganda. Going down with the ship is no longer a noble thing to do but stupid. The number of times I have disputed those figures and proved them wrong and now even Mr Numbers himself doesn't use them and he has been given a new set of numbers that has no relevance to what we are going through but he still has to use them....He is an addict after all.....Do some research and then come back and quote the real numbers...The GCs got stung on that one before with the shite they were spewing out about the number the TUrks killed that turned out to be TCs....Get with the times baggy boy.......and then you will not make such a fool of yourself.

As for fighting for VP and Mr_from_NG.........With my life. They are my true brothers that are the real unificationists but with heads held high and rights intact. Not bent over the table trying to sew their foreskins back on like you....

[Viewpoint]

utu how long can you try to ignore snide remarks and insults, there comes a time like in 1974 when you have to stand up for what you believe in and fight back.

Like what happened with Expatkiwi? For his pro-independence stance for the north, he ended up getting more than just snide remarks and insults. He faced a direct threat to himself and his family. Not exactly what one expects from a forum.

utu I have faced the same barrage of insults and accusations from GCs and TCs who cannot see or accept that there is different viewpoints on solving the Cyprus problem, they live in some sort of utopia (mostly abroad) and try to dictate to us that we are wrong and what is best for our future. Well what I suggest to those people are firstly return to Cyprus north or south and then decide with more insight to what actually goes on here, see first hand that neither side has any intention of solving jack shit because they lack vision, understanding or courage to compromise in order to find a solution. The opposite to unification is agreed partition which is not as bad as people try to make out it is, we are 90% of the way there anyway.

Since you are so smart and most TC living in the UK and the "TRNC" wants Partition, why have you not proposed to take the 18% and be done with it. You know by now, that the RoC is not going to give you more or allow any formal recognition to the North, so why are you waiting. Why doesn't Talat make a proposal to PapaD and make an even break. Hell, PapaD might even round it up to 20% if you asked nicely. You tell us it's about controlling your own destiny and keeping stolen land is not your aim, then make the proposal. Then you can have whom ever you wished in your "country". As soon as the deal is signed, Kifeas and his crew will start building the 20ft wall for once and for good. From then on, you will be on your own, in bed with Turkey or whom ever, will be your choice entirely. So simple, make the request and see what happens. You are now talking about an "Agreed Partition", since you have given up on the "Forced Partition" because no one is willing to help you get it, and rather than be seen as " Pirates of the Mediterranean", it will do you good to do something honest for a change.

I've changed my mind...If you are not Greek then I will eat your boat...If you've really got one that is.....We are not asking anymore big boy..We are demanding our rights.....The day that you voted OXI to the Annan Plan we woke up. No more sleeping.

Bingo zan this man is not a TC, I have always claimed this, he twists and turns to weave his bullshit...and is just as GC as makarios. A person who has not interacted with TCs since he was 6 cannot have any understanding or appreciation of the TC viewpoint, not once has he support 1 TC arguement or argued against a GC viewpoint...something very fishy here and all his rantings and bullshit indicate he is 100% Greek.

[Kikapu]

There you go with the uneducated 200,000 refugee claim straight out of the GC propaganda book.....Happy reading my friend.

199,999. Happy Now.

If not, then you can tell us which numbers will make it easier for you to sleep at night.

What I would like is for you to educate yourself on facts and not take the GC party line of propaganda. Going down with the ship is no longer a noble thing to do but stupid. The number of times I have disputed those figures and proved them wrong and now even Mr Numbers himself doesn't use them and he has been given a new set of numbers that has no relevance to what we are going through but he still has to use them....He is an addict after all.....Do some research and then come back and quote the real numbers...The GCs got stung on that one before with the shite they were spewing out about the number the TUrks killed that turned out to be TCs....Get with the times baggy boy.......and then you will not make such a fool of yourself.

As for fighting for VP and Mr_from_NG.........With my life. They are my true brothers that are the real unificationists but with heads held high and rights intact. Not bent over the table trying to sew their foreskins back on like you....

Thanks for all the things I did not ask for Zan, but thanks all the same.

Now, please tell me what numbers will you be happy with, so that you can sleep at nights with a clear conscience, that's all.