Cyprus-Forum.com

[Nikitas]

"Excellent! So why don't you and Zan just bugger off to the nations you each respect and leave ours alone?"

Gotta admit, this is funny! Not making fun of the people it addresses but the spirit of it. Very Cypriot! Reminds me of old wise people in the village!

[zan]

"Excellent! So why don't you and Zan just bugger off to the nations you each respect and leave ours alone?"

Gotta admit, this is funny! Not making fun of the people it addresses but the spirit of it. Very Cypriot! Reminds me of old wise people in the village!

Quite a lot of inbreeding was there??

[phoenix]

"Excellent! So why don't you and Zan just bugger off to the nations you each respect and leave ours alone?"

Gotta admit, this is funny! Not making fun of the people it addresses but the spirit of it. Very Cypriot! Reminds me of old wise people in the village!

Quite a lot of inbreeding was there??

Well the Ottomans did reduce the island's population, so less to choose from . . . and they had to avoid out breeding with the invaders, so . . .

[zan]

"Excellent! So why don't you and Zan just bugger off to the nations you each respect and leave ours alone?"

Gotta admit, this is funny! Not making fun of the people it addresses but the spirit of it. Very Cypriot! Reminds me of old wise people in the village!

Quite a lot of inbreeding was there??

Well the Ottomans did reduce the island's population, so less to choose from . . . and they had to avoid out breeding with the invaders, so . . .

And so!!!!!!!!!GR

[Get Real!]

"Excellent! So why don't you and Zan just bugger off to the nations you each respect and leave ours alone?"

Gotta admit, this is funny! Not making fun of the people it addresses but the spirit of it. Very Cypriot! Reminds me of old wise people in the village!

Quite a lot of inbreeding was there??

Well the Ottomans did reduce the island's population, so less to choose from . . . and they had to avoid out breeding with the invaders, so . . .

And so!!!!!!!!!GR

Is someone implying that I'm a cross between a serf, a janissary, and a Cypriot womble? Because that would explain a lot...

[zan]

"Excellent! So why don't you and Zan just bugger off to the nations you each respect and leave ours alone?"

Gotta admit, this is funny! Not making fun of the people it addresses but the spirit of it. Very Cypriot! Reminds me of old wise people in the village!

Quite a lot of inbreeding was there??

Well the Ottomans did reduce the island's population, so less to choose from . . . and they had to avoid out breeding with the invaders, so . . .

And so!!!!!!!!!GR

Is someone implying that I'm a cross between a serf, a janissary, and a Cypriot womble? Because that would explain a lot...

Only to a person of such breeding.......

[utu]

:shock: Is someone implying that I'm a cross between a serf, a janissary, and a Cypriot womble? Because that would explain a lot...

You really want people to answer this??!!! That's like offering free napalm to pyromaniacs...

[miltiades]

Take note:

The most ridiculous and treasonous suggestions always seem to come from the half-literate pseudo-Cypriot traitors living in Greece like Epsilon, Chapfallen, Nikiforos, and a few other twits posting under macho Greek aliases from Greek mythology and similar crap.

Many of these halfwits and/or their family are EOKA B remnants who fled to Greece to avoid getting lynched after the Turkish invasion.

The clues to look out for are:

1. Stereotypical Greek name for an alias.
2. Poor command of English.
3. Affiliation with "motherland" Greece.
4. Disrespect towards the RoC.
5. Denial of Cypriot history, culture, and inheritance.
6. Quick to jump to the idea of partition or other catastrophic scenario.

Regards, GR.

Just to clear a thing or two about Miltiades , that could also fall into above category of "stereotypical Greek names" It is my REAL second name , it appears on my Passport , on my credit cards and on all other official documents , BUT I AINT A BLOODY GREEK . IM A CYPRIOT FIRST MY MILES AND THEN A GREEK CYPRIOT WITH THE EPHASIS ON CYPRIOT.
These motherland bullshitters can make their dream come true and embrace their PERCEIVED motherlands by moving out .What is wrong with being a Cypriot , unless of course you are a bloody foreigner on our island. Peoples from all nations on earth are nationals of their country , the Maltese , the Spaniards , the Romanians , the Russians and every other known ethnicity , when it comes to Cyprus , we have first class brainwashed individuals denying even the existence of the Cypriot ethnicity. Well I have got news for them. The entire world recognises the Cypriot passport which states nationality as Cypriot , it recognises our currency which , albeit until January 08 , is called Cyprus pounds. Our POTATOES are marketed as Cyprus Potatoes and so are bamies but when it comes to the motherland bullshitters , we do not exist !!!
LONG LIVE CYPRUS AND THE PEOPLE , ALL THE PEOPLE OF CYPRUS AND MAY ONE DAY WE RID OURSELVES OF THE CANCEROUS MOTHERLAND BULLSHIT .

[Tim Drayton]

Epsilon,

You say that you have been won over to Denktash's dream. Fine, but which dream? If you look at Denktash's career you could argue that he has made statements or engaged in acts which support three different policies.

1. His famous comment which angered the first Turkish Ambassador appointed to the RoC in 1960, Emin Dirvana, was, "You have come as an ambassador and will depart as a district governor." He meant that Cyprus would be partitioned and part of the island would become a province of Turkey. So, here he appears to support full annexation of part of Cyprus to the Turkish Republic.

2. His statement, "We will keep it alive forever" with reference to the "TRNC" implies that he sees the creation of an independent, sovereign Turkish Cypriot state as an end goal and not a tactic in the direction of annexation.

3. Despite 1 and 2, we saw the same Denktash time and time again sitting down at the negotiating table trying to find a formula for reuniting the island. If he genuinely believed positions 1 or 2 above, surely he would turn round to the UN and say, "The problem has been solved. There is no need for any further negotiations."

So, I am genuinely curious. Which of the above three "dreams" is the one that has won you over?

OK, Denktash has made it abundantly clear in statements he has made that he only consented to take part in negotiations to make other people happy, and in the firm conviction that they would end in failure.

So, Denktash's dream was either 1 or 2 above. And the difference between these two options is of more than just academic imprtance for Cyprus.

Glafcos Clerides is reported to have made the following comment in the 1960's (source Fileleftheros 20 September 1992) "Today we Greek Cypriots fully control the government. There is neither a Vice-President armed with a veto nor are there three Turkish ministers. All the ministers are Greek. The international community recognises our government alone. Why should we bring the Turks back in among us… Today the Turks are only able to control their positions; that is three percent of the total land. Since they are not rich in resources they are in a weak economic position. In the end, they will capitulate to our decisions or get up and go." Sound familiar? I think this reflects the position of Greek Cypriot partitionists today, except that they are prepared to concede considerably more than three percent.

However, this position contains a fatal flaw if applied to the current-day situation. This is because, of the options I have listed above, partition if finalised will lead to result 1 above and not 2. The northern part of Cyprus is not today an enclave in which Turkish Cypriots eke out precarious existences under the constant threat of embargoes. The north of Cyprus is already de facto a province of the Turkish Republic. Recent debate in the Turkish Cypriot press has concluded that the only institution over which the "government" in the north has any control is the fire brigade! This is a puppet regime controlled by Turkey. The only reason that the pretence of a sovereign state is kept up is to keep the option of a negotiated settlement open. Totally remove that option and annexation to Turkey will only be a matter of time. The word "forever" is virtually the first thing that greets people crossing to the north at Ledra Palace; personally I don't believe it. Denktash's dream has always been annexation to Turkey, and the "TRNC" for him was just a tactical move on that road.

So, Epslon, what you are actually arguing for when you say you support Denktash's dream is for a border between Turkey and Cyprus to rum across this island. Moreover, given the rate with which settlers are being moved into Cyprus from Turkey, you would face a population on the other side of this border consisting mostly not of Turkish Cypriots who have a very similar culture to Greek Cypriots and have a collective memory of times when all Cypriots lived together in harmony, but of mainland Turks who have been whipped up into a frenzy of nationalistic hate against Greek Cypriots. Is this what you dream of? Would the rest of Cyprus ever breathe easy again if this happened? And, once you reach this situation, the game will have ended. There will be no turning back.

You are entitled to your opinion, but please think the consequences through.

[Nikitas]

Tim,

Are there enough Turkish Cypriots left in the north to make any kind of intercommunal, meaningful solution posible? The population census (what I saw of it anyway) shows that the settlers already outnumber the indigenous Cypriots. In effect we have partition and practically enosis of the north with Turkey.

From your experience of the north and your visits there how reversible is this situation? Is there any realistic hope of achieving a real federal solution agreed between the two communities? Sometimes I think that in 1974 the Greek Cypriots managed to rebel and get rid of the mainland Greeks from Cyprus. There was a horrific price but at least it left 67 per cent of the island free. It seems that the only way to free the north is a revolt by Turkish Cypriots, if there are enough of them left to revolt.