Cyprus-Forum.com

[Nikitas]

Some background here,

Some personal background. When I was studying Public International Law my teacher was preofessor Mazawi, who at the time was also Britain's representative at the Law of the Sea conference so I followed the situation closley and with good first hand info. At that time, early 70s, Greece did not want to change the territorial waters from the then customary 3 miles, with some states claiming 6 miles. The reason was obvious, Greece being a major international civilian maritime power wanted maximum freedom of the high seas. Greece was overriden by most other nations and the norm for territorial waters was set at 12 miles. With some new additions- all ships, including warships can cross national waters of another state going to and from their ports to international waters.

The end result was that Greece found itself with a legal right it had not pursued- namely to extend its territorial waters to 12 miles. Turkey reacted with the now famous casus belli, if Greece were to exercise her right then it would be cause for war. Since then there are daily skirmishes in the Aegean, in the sea and air as each side tests the other. Apart from the danger there is also the expense, it costs about the price of a school classroom to send up two jets to intercept two other jets.

The USA was till now wary of ratifying the Law of the Sea. If it does then there will be no more excuses for Greece not following suit and demand the same rights, and it would be pretty hard to refuse. As noted above, where the sea is too narrow (less than 24 miles) tne median line is the border.

Cyprus too would have the added weight of the USA practice behind it when it claims rights to the Exclusive Economic Zone between Cyprus and Egypt.

If this situation materializes thirty five years of tension, expense and a few dozen lives will have been wasted for nothing. All it takes to solve the problem is for someone in the USA to put a signature on a piece of paper.

[DT.]

THis was in the news yesterday. Following the melting of polar ice, and the subsequent exposing of land masses the US is thinking of ratifying the Law of the Sea Convention.

The convention defines the territorial waters and exclusive economic zones. The US had not ratified the treaty. The melting of polar ice presents new facts and a race is now on between the nations that border the pole to claim and exploit natural resources.

If the US ratifies the treaty then it will immediately recognise rights afforded by the treaty to other nations, like the 12 mile territorial waters for all states, presumably including Greek territorial waters in the Aegean.

Then Turkey can also claim it's 12 miles of territorial waters, right?

Ha Ha you moron!!!!!! If Turkey expands to 12 miles in the Med then that means Greece does as well! If they do within land closer than 12 miles then they split the difference....the rest though:

Now without 12 miles
Greece circa 45% of Aegean
Turkey circa 7%
Rest International waters

After 12 miles
Greece circa 75%
Turkey 9%
International waters the rest

Nice one Cartman lets do what you say. (unless off course you follow Turkish logic and only increase Turkey's coastline by 12 and threaten with war if Greece does the same.)

It seems that only DT understand how the application of the treaty is works.Greece is requesting application of the treaty long-long time now-

If DT could expand on his abbreviated sentences we could all understand what he is saying. Could you please explain in an intelligible manner to clarify your meaning. I might have the gist of what you are trying to say but like to be sure.

Thank you

apologies Deniz I'll try to make it clearer.

As things stand now Greece has about 45% of the Aegean as Greek waters with Turkey only 7%. This stands now at 6miles coastline for each country. The rest is international waters. Turkey has issued a casus belli on greece if it expands to 12 miles like every other Med country (including Turkey in the Black Sea) due to the fact that Turkey has access to the Aegean through the international waters in it which now stand at about 50%.

If greece goes to 12 miles as its entitled to then the second map posted before will come into efffect creating a Greek lake in the Aegean providing no access to Turkish warships.

As a twist to this story Greece has increased its FIR (Air space) to 12 miles which is why Turkish f16s keep violating Greek airspace and keep getting turned back by Greek ones.

However if we go with Eric's idea we will all be happy...well the Greeks and Eric will...until he figures it out.

[Nikitas]

As Copperline notes above the delimitation of the Exclusive Economic Zone is a pain, but as you can see from the maps, once the 12 mile limit is drawn on the Aegean the exercise over the EEZ becomes somewhat irrelevant.

As for Utu's comment of the Aegean becoming Hellenig, well even with the current 6 mile it pretty much is a Greek sea by a quirk of Geography. The craggy coastline gives a total length of 16000 kilometers, multiply that by 6 and you have a lot of sea territory. Add to that the daily presence of ships linking several hundred islands and..... well you get a Greek sea.

[Pyrpolizer]

It might be more honest to rename the Agean Sea the Hellenic Sea. It would at least be more accurate, given the amount of Greek territory there.

Perhaps you don't know how much it costs Greece to support people on all those islands most of which do not even have drinking water. As for electricity, transportation etc imagine to build a house you have to carry even the bricks with a boat. Cost of living on the islands is huge. And the resources of the inhabitants other than fish from the sea almost nil. Therefore yes Greece should be compensated for that by exploiting whatever wealth her sea can provide her. It is her islands that are in that sea, not Turkey's.

[Eric dayi]

THis was in the news yesterday. Following the melting of polar ice, and the subsequent exposing of land masses the US is thinking of ratifying the Law of the Sea Convention.

The convention defines the territorial waters and exclusive economic zones. The US had not ratified the treaty. The melting of polar ice presents new facts and a race is now on between the nations that border the pole to claim and exploit natural resources.

If the US ratifies the treaty then it will immediately recognise rights afforded by the treaty to other nations, like the 12 mile territorial waters for all states, presumably including Greek territorial waters in the Aegean.

Then Turkey can also claim it's 12 miles of territorial waters, right?

Eric, I have always feared you ....

I am honoured.

until I read your question above !

Ahhhh...but like other GCs, you also did not understand why. Never mind, maybe another time eh?

[DT.]

I think I understand!

DOes it have something to do with you as a baby and gravity?