Cyprus-Forum.com

[alexISS]

SN said about Cypriots

"As if they have anything Greek..."

Which brings us to the problem with both our "motherlands" they cannot accept that we Cypriots are more Greek and more Turkish then them, so they want to cut us down to their degenerate size. They cannot tolerate small communities of true Greeks and Turks outside their borders, independent, who might prove that they can do things better than either "motherland". We Greek Cypriots almost fell for it, got saved in the nick of time but paid a huge price for it. The Turkish Cypriots are still paying and the price is even heavier.

The best thing about SN being in the forum is to show Turkish Cypriots a true mainlander when he is at home. Notice that the overall approach is "it was not me, it is those other assholes, the fascists, the conservative Greeks who are stuck in their way of thinking", any rationalistaion to avoid taking responsibility for anything. Reminds me so much of what happens when two Athenian drivers have a fender bender! No one ever accepts responsibility, they would rather spend ten thousand Euros on a court case than give a hundred Euros to fix the other guy's light.

Wasn't pre 67 Greece the one that was trying to convince Makarios (and all Cypriots) that union was not feasible and that independence was the best option? How on earth do you reach the conclusion that Greece "cannot tolerate small communities of true Greeks" outside her borders, when Greece tried to promote Cypriot independence AGAINST the wish of Cypriots? Are you perhaps referring exclusively to the junta period? Do you maybe consider the governments of that period as representative of the Greek people??

[Nikitas]

SN

Refer to the televied parliamentary debate of the early 90s when Mitsotakis and Papandreou, both members of the Center Union government of the 60 said clearly that Greek policy of the time was for union. Makarios had nothing to do with that decisions. Junta leader Papadopoulos in 1968 changed his tune and withdrew the Greek division put there by Papandreou the elder.

Greece has systematically undermined and weakened all centers of Hellenism outside its borders and today it only refers to them and uses them for her own benefit, not theirs. Look at what happened to the Greeks of Egypt, Pontos, Cyprus. See how the system works in regards to overseas Greeks (those in America, Australia etc) and look at how these people are treated when they try to contribute to their "motherland". The treatment starts withj ridiculing their lack of linguistic facility, with non recognition of their academic titles, cynicism about their intentions etc. There is even the precedent of one Greek American having his Geophysics degree rejected because at the time the Athens mandarins had not yet started a geophysics course in Athens University. THerefore they declared the science of geophysis as non existent!

And go down to custom one day and look at how the repatriating Pontioi are treated by the "civils servants" (should be renamed civil dynasts in Greece).

The bottom line is that Athens culture is unable to deal fairly with Greeks who have matured and accomplished things in an environment that cafe inhabitants of Athens do not control. The complex is deeply rooted in their village ancestry. They are uncomofrable with their peasant origins and deny them, but they cannot wait to pull everyone down to their level. Peasant in this context is a psychological term not a class one.

[Nikitas]

For the Cypriots here-

My first days in Greece and I am having car trouble, a worn clutch. So I go to the mechanic and ask for a clutch replacement on the Mini.

"Clutch? What is that?" Says the mechanic. I explain.

"You Cypriots must learn Greek, that part we call braillage in Greek!!!!" he retorts with the imperiousness of a thousand Cardinals. Braillage is of course not Greek but French derived. I should have told him to clutch his balls tight.

[SN]

SN

Refer to the televied parliamentary debate of the early 90s when Mitsotakis and Papandreou, both members of the Center Union government of the 60 said clearly that Greek policy of the time was for union. Makarios had nothing to do with that decisions. Junta leader Papadopoulos in 1968 changed his tune and withdrew the Greek division put there by Papandreou the elder.

Greece has systematically undermined and weakened all centers of Hellenism outside its borders and today it only refers to them and uses them for her own benefit, not theirs. Look at what happened to the Greeks of Egypt, Pontos, Cyprus. See how the system works in regards to overseas Greeks (those in America, Australia etc) and look at how these people are treated when they try to contribute to their "motherland". The treatment starts withj ridiculing their lack of linguistic facility, with non recognition of their academic titles, cynicism about their intentions etc. There is even the precedent of one Greek American having his Geophysics degree rejected because at the time the Athens mandarins had not yet started a geophysics course in Athens University. THerefore they declared the science of geophysis as non existent!

And go down to custom one day and look at how the repatriating Pontioi are treated by the "civils servants" (should be renamed civil dynasts in Greece).

The bottom line is that Athens culture is unable to deal fairly with Greeks who have matured and accomplished things in an environment that cafe inhabitants of Athens do not control. The complex is deeply rooted in their village ancestry. They are uncomofrable with their peasant origins and deny them, but they cannot wait to pull everyone down to their level. Peasant in this context is a psychological term not a class one.

We know about the bullshit of the Greek state policies and their inability to help Hellenism outside Greece.
Greece has a petty way of dealing with national issues.She cares only and if money is in the picture,that is why Greece doesnt give a shit about Cyprus.If oil is found in Cyprus then we might as well declare union on the spot without the GC will.That is how retarded we can get.

About the geophysics issue.This is also known but it has nothing to do with arrogance.It has to do with vital interests of the internal Greek academia.They have a bullshit way of academically recognizing degrees based on the ''isotimia antistoihia'' thing which only applies in Greece.If you have only ''isotimia'' or only ''antistoihia'' you dont get a recognition you need to have both.Basically it is a bullshit way of blocking Greeks that studied outside Greece since we are the first country internationally in exporting students abroad.This way by making bullshit academic issues out of nothing they block or prolong the entry in the ''agora ergasias'' of the Greeks that had studied outside Greece,just to control the influx of the young scientists entering Greece and keep their monopoly their way.
In fact i lost 8 months from my life for this bullshit recognition issue.I had to wait 3 months for an answer and when i challenged their decision(they said i should pass two extra exams in Greece to get the antistoihia) i had to wait 5 extra months before they recognize my degree.
I mean if i didnt challenge their decision i would have finished my job in 15 days.I could have passed 20 exams in 5 months they had me waiting.Instead they made me wait 5 months to tell me i was right ...Not to mention the money i lost to the lawyers

I have even heard stories that even people from Harvard need to pass exams for their recognition.The retardeness of this country is unique i must say.
The wanna persuade me that the TEI in Kolopetinitsa is better than Harvard?I tell you its all about money.

[SN]

For the Cypriots here-

My first days in Greece and I am having car trouble, a worn clutch. So I go to the mechanic and ask for a clutch replacement on the Mini.

"Clutch? What is that?" Says the mechanic. I explain.

"You Cypriots must learn Greek, that part we call braillage in Greek!!!!" he retorts with the imperiousness of a thousand Cardinals. Braillage is of course not Greek but French derived. I should have told him to clutch his balls tight.

Pending my mood i also do that
If i like the Cypriot person i have next to me i am ok.If i dont then i force him to speak proper Greek.Even though i am trained to the Cypriot dialect due to many Cypriot collegues i have had in uni i sometimes pretend i dont understand just to make them speak proper Greek

[Nikitas]

SN

I tried the DIKATSA experiment. It took 19 months to get partial recognition. The mystery is why not have a logical system as Cyprus where you are told what recognition a degree has BEFORE you go overseas to study? It is little details like this that show how Cyprus would become if Union ever comes about. There is no possibility that Cyprus would ever be allowed to contribute to the mix, the only possibility is being swallowed up in the system (ifyou can call it that) of the "motherland".

But when a bunch of academics from a small country sit in concert and take it on themselves to decide whether Harvard or Cambridge PhD is as good as their degree is that not arrogance? How else would you call it?

As for "proper Greek" , it is a dead language after Babiniotis finished with it. He managed single handedly to take all musicality out of the language, banishing double consonants because modern Greek, ie Athens pronunciation, does not use them. Yet people from the islands, like Kythnos and Kos and Kalymnos speak? They use double consonants all the time. I am eagerly awaiting the time when the Babiniotites will rewrite Elada and Thalasa like they did with Rosia. Who said proper is only what derives from Athens? Is it not arrogance to reject the pronunciation used by the majority of the country?

A personal note- I can speak with some experience re Greekness because I am half and half, half Cypriot half mainlander. I choose Cypriot as my nationality because it is the more Greek of the two. I also lived in Egypt and in the UK as part of the diaspora and not simply as a student. It is no accident that Lawrence Durrel called Cyprus the most Greek island. But of course he could understand Cypriots because he grew up and learned his Greek in Corfu, with an almost identical dialect.

Pray do tell- do you also correct people from Crete and Rodos and the Pontioi when they are speaking? Wonder what reaction you get from them.

[Nikitas]

Another point re the mainland Greek attitude- when Magdi Yacoub the cardiologist was brought in by private jet to examine the late former Prime Minister, did anyone check to see if his degree was the equivalent of a Greek medical degree? Did the Athens Medical Association grant him a temporary license to practice medicine in Greece?

Rhetorical questions. The situation does illustrate how in Greece they have yet to realise the Turks have gone and that the country is independent. So they still behave like serfs and do the bidding when the "Big man" wants something. Vai vai vai...

[SN]

Nikitas i could not afford ''a partial recognition'' in Greece.It was all or nothing.Btw i did the Doatap experience which is kinda better.At least i wait 8 months.With Dikatsa it was like 1 year minimum.
It is not arrogance Nikita.You have to be more vigilant than that.Off course it is a matter of ''academia interests'' and how to block the thousands Greeks studying abroad.
Also what you say about knowing before about your recognition it still applies...You only had to consult the recognized unies list and then choose the place you can go to study.So if you choose a uni not contained in the list then by definition you are left with partial recognition or no recognition at all....