Cyprus-Forum.com

[halil]

Presidential Spokesman Hasan Ercakica accused the Greek Cypriot leader Tasos Papadopoulos as using the press to manipulate the issues concerning the Cyprus problem and laying blame of the unsuccessful 8th of July process on the Turkish Cypriot side.

Referring to the meeting which took place between President Mehmet Ali Talat, the leader of the Greek Cypriot administration Tasos Papadopoulos and the UN Secretary General’s special representative to Cyprus Michael Moller, Mr Ercakica said that it was only natural that Mr Moller would be holding some contacts after the meeting between the two leaders.
‘It is Mr Moller’s duty as the good offices mission to find ways for the two leaders to meet on the island’, he added.

Noting that the Greek Cypriot leader Tasos Papadopoulos had said that he had asked for the 8th of July process to be implemented but that President Mehmet Ali Talat had rejected this, the Presidential spokesman drew attention to the fact that the Greek Cypriot leader didn’t even know what he wanted.

‘For a solution to be found to the Cyprus problem we need a person who knows what he wants and who has political leverage,’ said the presidential spokesman.

Noting that the Turkish Cypriot side had clearly outlined what it wanted, Mr Ercakica said the main aim of the Turkish Cypriot side is to find a comprehensive solution to the Cyprus problem and they have adapted the principle that the status quo is unacceptable.

‘The 8th of July process is the road that will lead us to this aim, and we want to speed up the process,’ he said adding that Mr Papadopoulos didn’t clarify what he wanted and was manipulating the press.

He concluded by explaining that in line with the 8th of July process the Turkish Cypriot side wanted the Greek Cypriot side to be willing to find a solution to the Cyprus problem and agree to return to the negotiating table.

[Pyrpolizer]

kikapu - many of us do actually. Our surname tradition was quite primitive and lacked any true systematic. It was an oriental structure accustomed from the Ottomans: you either got the name of your father as surname (which means a new surname for essentially every generation making it extremely difficult to keep a record for civil purposes) or your "lakap" (title/reputation/job) was used. I would confidently say "Kalyoncu" was a lakap of his family who perhaps was associated with the business: "Kalyoncu" means "one who uses/rides/in the business of Kalyon" and "Kalyon" is a type of ship that was widely used by the Ottomans and other Mediaterranean empires prior to the 19-18th century (see Galeon).

Yeah right! And by doing that you developed such a perfect system, that you can not tell for sure how many settlers and how many real TCs you have. Isn't that what you recent census proved beyond any doubt?

Pyro....The system is soooo perfect that I cannot trace my old school friends any more..Just to give you a relevant example; I had no idea that Ahmet An was my old school friend Ahmet Cavit (Djavit as some spell it on this forum)...It took me years to make the connection...Those who pretend that this is just an incidental procedure are only fooling themselves...They know damn well it is all part of the "Turkification" of the TCs...Now we can look forward to the "Islamisation" of the TCs as well...But what is in a name or a faith, right?????

I never knew Ahmet An became Ahmet Cavit, Birkibrisli gardash. What a shame... He still uses his old name btw, I mean he is the known Doctor isn't he?
Man your class produced some fine men my friend, congrats.

[zan]

kikapu - many of us do actually. Our surname tradition was quite primitive and lacked any true systematic. It was an oriental structure accustomed from the Ottomans: you either got the name of your father as surname (which means a new surname for essentially every generation making it extremely difficult to keep a record for civil purposes) or your "lakap" (title/reputation/job) was used. I would confidently say "Kalyoncu" was a lakap of his family who perhaps was associated with the business: "Kalyoncu" means "one who uses/rides/in the business of Kalyon" and "Kalyon" is a type of ship that was widely used by the Ottomans and other Mediaterranean empires prior to the 19-18th century (see Galeon).

Yeah right! And by doing that you developed such a perfect system, that you can not tell for sure how many settlers and how many real TCs you have. Isn't that what you recent census proved beyond any doubt?

Pyro....The system is soooo perfect that I cannot trace my old school friends any more..Just to give you a relevant example; I had no idea that Ahmet An was my old school friend Ahmet Cavit (Djavit as some spell it on this forum)...It took me years to make the connection...Those who pretend that this is just an incidental procedure are only fooling themselves...They know damn well it is all part of the "Turkification" of the TCs...Now we can look forward to the "Islamisation" of the TCs as well...But what is in a name or a faith, right?????

So what!!!!! So what if it is the Turkification of the TRNC/KKTC. We belong to the island and as long as there is no settlement we will call ourselves and the part of our island what ever the hell we like. We will not sit around and wait for your siege to work. It ain't gonna happen. Every way we can find to get around that siege we will do. I really don't understand how you and Kiks can just sit there and wish the worse for your people just so you can be proved right.


Why was the settlement that Makarios was ready to sign never signed????? Tell me that and stop all this which hunt shit....The name change was for many reasons and what tthey were for is up to us and nothing to do with you just like we have no say in the "RoC".

[T_C]

The worst thing is that I even know GCs who don't trust those two...but that doesn't stop them giving them praise on the forum for their stance on the Cyprob.

[phoenix]

So what!!!!! So what if it is the Turkification of the TRNC/KKTC. We belong to the island and as long as there is no settlement we will call ourselves and the part of our island what ever the hell we like. We will not sit around and wait for your siege to work. It ain't gonna happen. Every way we can find to get around that siege we will do. I really don't understand how you and Kiks can just sit there and wish the worse for your people just so you can be proved right.

You are treading on dangerous territory . . .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gf-Q2rDd6Tw

Pip-pip
Phoenix

[Nikitas]

Bir said:

"What is happening to the TCs in the North is nothing less then cultural genocide and ethnic cleansing. And the tragedy is they seem to be willing participants in their own identity extinction... " and says this is a consequence of the rather late application of the old Kemalist policy of giving people surnames, among other things, to establish Turkey as a European nation.

This reminds me of the fanatic anticommunism of the mainland Greek officers of ELDYK in 1960. These people were veterans of the Greek Civil war, which cost 600 000 lives in mainland Greece and left a generation scarred with deep hatred for the other side. Anyway, these guys came to Cyprus, where the communist party was legal, and we had no civil war and they could not understand that the situation had nothing whatsoever to do with Greece of the 40s. THey spied on people, made dossiers on "known communists" who obviously were known since they were openly members of AKEL, and generally indulged in what in retrospect is seen as a witch hunt.

The determination by some Turks and some Turkish Cypriots to apply Kemalist ideas in northern Cyprus reminds me of that mainland Greek mania. Anyone who objects is treated as a traitor, and if things are as close as I think they are, then a "traitor" can be shot and no one will much care who did it, after all he was a "traitor".

The patience of the Turkish Cypriot community surprises me. At least Greek Cypriots had enough, and in 1974 they reacted and resisted the coup. The result was painful but it has left the Greek Cypriot community perceptibly more mature. Anyone suggesting keeping dossiers on communists today would be openly ridiculed. I see the Turkish CYpriots regressing and accepting these obsolete and useless ploys. By contrast remember what the president of Uzbekistan told Ozal when he went there touting Turkey's role as leader of the Turkish speaking world -"WE are the true Turks", which bears the possible interpretation of "fuckoff and leave us alone with your leadership bullshit". This is the puzzle with the situation. Are the Turkish Cypriots passive, tolerant, uncaring, or do they want to go through the process that is happening now in the north?

Coincidentally, today's column by Sener Levent in Politis newspaper is on this topic. His take on the matter is that there is no such thing as Turkish Cypriot community or will in the north anymore. Northern Cyprus has been conqurered by Turkey and that explains everything that happens there.

[BirKibrisli]

kikapu - many of us do actually. Our surname tradition was quite primitive and lacked any true systematic. It was an oriental structure accustomed from the Ottomans: you either got the name of your father as surname (which means a new surname for essentially every generation making it extremely difficult to keep a record for civil purposes) or your "lakap" (title/reputation/job) was used. I would confidently say "Kalyoncu" was a lakap of his family who perhaps was associated with the business: "Kalyoncu" means "one who uses/rides/in the business of Kalyon" and "Kalyon" is a type of ship that was widely used by the Ottomans and other Mediaterranean empires prior to the 19-18th century (see Galeon).

Yeah right! And by doing that you developed such a perfect system, that you can not tell for sure how many settlers and how many real TCs you have. Isn't that what you recent census proved beyond any doubt?

Pyro....The system is soooo perfect that I cannot trace my old school friends any more..Just to give you a relevant example; I had no idea that Ahmet An was my old school friend Ahmet Cavit (Djavit as some spell it on this forum)...It took me years to make the connection...Those who pretend that this is just an incidental procedure are only fooling themselves...They know damn well it is all part of the "Turkification" of the TCs...Now we can look forward to the "Islamisation" of the TCs as well...But what is in a name or a faith, right?????

I never knew Ahmet An became Ahmet Cavit, Birkibrisli gardash. What a shame... He still uses his old name btw, I mean he is the known Doctor isn't he?
Man your class produced some fine men my friend, congrats.

It is actually the other way around,dear Pyro...I knew him as Ahmet Cavit...Yes ,he is the infamous doctor... I am very pround of him...My old class- mate...He was always a bit out of the ordinary...

[Murataga]

kikapu - many of us do actually. Our surname tradition was quite primitive and lacked any true systematic. It was an oriental structure accustomed from the Ottomans: you either got the name of your father as surname (which means a new surname for essentially every generation making it extremely difficult to keep a record for civil purposes) or your "lakap" (title/reputation/job) was used. I would confidently say "Kalyoncu" was a lakap of his family who perhaps was associated with the business: "Kalyoncu" means "one who uses/rides/in the business of Kalyon" and "Kalyon" is a type of ship that was widely used by the Ottomans and other Mediaterranean empires prior to the 19-18th century (see Galeon).

Yeah right! And by doing that you developed such a perfect system, that you can not tell for sure how many settlers and how many real TCs you have. Isn't that what you recent census proved beyond any doubt?

So let me get this straight... You speak Greek, your names are Greek and there is no problem for you to have Greek surnames. We speak Turkish, we have Turkish names and it is a problem that we drop the backwarded Ottoman style of giving ourselves Turkish surnnames and start doing it in a way that is being done in modern soceities ?

"Kalyoncu" family is as TC as it gets; it was their lakap and it became their surname (without anything being forced). I can tell you quite easily that there are at least 20-30 families out of a population of 70 million in Turkey that has a last name "Kalyoncu". How many Papadopoulos`es would you say there are in Greece?

[Nikitas]

Murataga the doing is not the problem, the being forced to do it is the problem.

And when you choose to do it you can pick any name you want. Hence the Greek joke- man goes to the registry office to change his name. Clerk asks him his current name, he responds: Yannis Malakas. And his choice for his new name? Giorgos Malakas.

So you see it is all about free choice.

[Murataga]

Murataga the doing is not the problem, the being forced to do it is the problem.

And when you choose to do it you can pick any name you want. Hence the Greek joke- man goes to the registry office to change his name. Clerk asks him his current name, he responds: Yannis Malakas. And his choice for his new name? Giorgos Malakas.

So you see it is all about free choice.

And if you read my post previos to the last one you can understand why there is absolutely nothing forced on anyone - nothing. Hence I quote:

As for your claim about people being "forced" - it is not true. No TC was forced to change their name, period. However, the the fossilized Ottoman system for surnames (unmatched in any modern society by the 20th century) was abolished and people were asked to adopt new surnames (not names as you imply). As long as there were no conflicts (no repetition among families for obvious reasons of having a surname in the first place) people were either allowed to use their family "lakap"s (as in the example of Kalyoncu) as surnames or their existing father name as surname or offered (as long as the specific surname was something they liked and felt comfortable to use) / asked to come up with new ones .

It is a product of your imagination to reinforce your arguement which I am afraid is completely detached from reality.

Our surname tradition was quite primitive and lacked any true systematic. It was an oriental structure accustomed from the Ottomans: you either got the name of your father as surname (which means a new surname for essentially every generation making it extremely difficult to keep a record for civil purposes) or your "lakap" (title/reputation/job) was used. This is not practiced in any modern society. some here are trying to find something to support their cause because we abolished the Otooman way of giving ourselves surnames. Pathetic...