Cyprus-Forum.com

[humanist]

I am only interested in hearing from People interested in a BBF for Cyprus from September 2007. Please do not respond if you are not willing to leave the past behind, Thank you

[paliometoxo]

what does bbf stand for?

[Get Real!]

what does bbf stand for?

Err, that's just a Buffet Breakfast feast. They help forget the painful past...

[paliometoxo]

sounds good

[Get Real!]

sounds good

You gotta rush with your reservation though... send a pm to Humanist...

[Pyrpolizer]

The content of BBF (Bizonal Bicommunal Federation) has never been agreed.

It seems the Turkish side translates that to 2 separate states that will just join together to have a common face in external affairs and the EU.
In fact they want:

a)A guaranteed or manipulated small number of refugees returning
b)To get to own the majority of (now illegally grabbed) GC properties through a scheme of compensations that the GCs will pay themselves.
c)A totally separate management of their "state" where they will be the absolute majority because there is no way for them to otherwise feel "first class citizens"
d)Absolutely no interference and on merging in business (because they say the GCs are economically stronger and they will subordinate them economically if they are let free to do bussiness in "their state")

These as far as BBF is concerned. Add to that the standard burdens they want to load us,IN ANY TYPE OF SOLUTION like

i) an equal number of Tuirkish settlers over and above the population of the TCs ii)A Loooong stay of the Turkish army to guarantee everything that gives the GCs any land back will be postponed indefinetely
ii)Loading all responsibility for all the illegalilties they ve done for 30 years like selling our stolen lands to foreigners, or donating them for free to settlers, to the new state.

AND MANY MORE ......

I would say not only BBF but any solution within the above lines is NEVER going to be accepted by the GCs.

[Nikitas]

Humanist,

BBF within the context of the European Union, with full implementation of principles like the right of movement, establishment, property ownership etc. then I am interested. The difficulty comes in the interpetation and the details of a BBF solution since it can mean different things to different people. Mr Talat said as much when he said that the full implementation of EU laws would negate the bizonality of a solution. That kind of statement makes me see that BBF can masquerade as partition.

I can see a situation where the political rights of each community are concentrated in its own component state, ie all Greek Cypriots vote in the Greek component state, all Turkish Cypriots in the Turkish one. Not strictly in accordance with European law but a small deviation in the circumstances. But at least a person can choose where to live, work, etc. The reason for this is that most true Cypriots have attachments to the locality they were born in or their family comes from and ( I believe) should be allowed to maintain those attachments.

Unacceptable would be any discrimination in favor of settlers and against Cypriots. It is inconceivable that settlers would be allowed to hold onto land and gain citizenship of such a future BBF state when there are hundreds of thousands of Cypriots all over the world who are not encouraged to return or invest in Cyprus. Most of us in this forum I gather are diaspora Cypriots, and can understand what I mean (hopefully).

The territorial division must take into account the true population proportions, the coastline (a major resource in a tourist oriented nation) and the British Bases, things not dealt with in the Annan plan. I posted on this elsewhere and just note here that the British base of Dekelia in the Annan plan divided the Greek Cypriot component state into two sections. Cultural, historic and religious sites are a matter to be dealt with too.

One last note, why BBF and not Multi communal, Multi regional Federation? What is wrong with the smaller communties of Cyprus (Armenians, Latins, Maronites and Rom0 having their own mini component states?

[humanist]

nikitas

BBF within the context of the European Union, with full implementation of principles like the right of movement, establishment, property ownership etc. then I am interested.

yes this one saounds fair,

One last note, why BBF and not Multi communal, Multi regional Federation? What is wrong with the smaller communties of Cyprus (Armenians, Latins, Maronites and Rom0 having their own mini component states?

this one is fairer and more inclussive of all Cypriots, howver I cannot see either side accepting and why not I have no idea other than racism

[Pyrpolizer]

Humanist,

BBF within the context of the European Union, with full implementation of principles like the right of movement, establishment, property ownership etc. then I am interested. The difficulty comes in the interpetation and the details of a BBF solution since it can mean different things to different people. Mr Talat said as much when he said that the full implementation of EU laws would negate the bizonality of a solution. That kind of statement makes me see that BBF can masquerade as partition.

I can see a situation where the political rights of each community are concentrated in its own component state, ie all Greek Cypriots vote in the Greek component state, all Turkish Cypriots in the Turkish one. Not strictly in accordance with European law but a small deviation in the circumstances. But at least a person can choose where to live, work, etc. The reason for this is that most true Cypriots have attachments to the locality they were born in or their family comes from and ( I believe) should be allowed to maintain those attachments.

Unacceptable would be any discrimination in favor of settlers and against Cypriots. It is inconceivable that settlers would be allowed to hold onto land and gain citizenship of such a future BBF state when there are hundreds of thousands of Cypriots all over the world who are not encouraged to return or invest in Cyprus. Most of us in this forum I gather are diaspora Cypriots, and can understand what I mean (hopefully).

The territorial division must take into account the true population proportions, the coastline (a major resource in a tourist oriented nation) and the British Bases, things not dealt with in the Annan plan. I posted on this elsewhere and just note here that the British base of Dekelia in the Annan plan divided the Greek Cypriot component state into two sections. Cultural, historic and religious sites are a matter to be dealt with too.

One last note, why BBF and not Multi communal, Multi regional Federation? What is wrong with the smaller communties of Cyprus (Armenians, Latins, Maronites and Rom0 having their own mini component states?

a)Everybody knows BBF is against the EU law and is very close to partition

b)Obviously this is what Papadopoulos means by saying he wants BBF. Small deviations. The question is does the TC side accept "small" deviations????? The answer is no. They want either full or nothing.

[humanist]

Pyr, I don't know that it is against EU law. Please provide more details if you wish. I would like to know more about it.

thanks