Cyprus-Forum.com

[humanist]

P.S. It is not true that Turkey did not concede a point. For a start the army would leave in a given space of time bar 350 soldiers. Then Famagusta along with Morphou would have been returned to their lawful inhabitants together with some 40 or so villages. Now doubt, the next plan will be worse, but of course we will not accept it, just as we rejected all plans since 1959. We prefer the situation to remain as it is because we are fools enough to believe that in due course the balance of power will change in our favour.

I think you have made you point clear, there is nothing else that I can say other than, that is fair enough, stand for what you believe and we will fight for what we beieve and for the time being we will continue to push for embargos. I have to say it is not my personal preferred option,

[Nikitas]

Bir and humanist,

The type of solution you both hint at, based on an amended 1960 agreement, has been proposed by one of the smaller political parties in Cyprus. I cannot remember exactly which politician proposed it, but I remember seeing him interviewed on the Cyprus satellite TV shortly after the Annan plan rejection. And he had an idea that might satisfy partitionists like Zan and others here- incorporate the bizonal federal arrangement within the 1960 constitution. The amendment of the 1960 Constitution, with the necessary amendments and a federal structure seems simple enough. Also, it brings the solution completely within the powers of the two communities without the need to involve outsiders, and the British Sovereign Base areas remain as they are.

It sounds simple, and easy to do, perhaps that is the problem. We do not like simple solutions, we Cypriots have complex minds!

Like you two, I dream of the day when the leaders of the two communities will exit the conference room with a statement starting with the words "we have come to a total agreement....." and knock all outsiders, friends and "motherlanders" flat on their back with a show of solidarity. I would dismiss it, but then I remember that the Berlin wall came down when we all regarded it as a permanent fixture that was to last forever.

[halil]

What happened to Papadopulos ?
He used to say: İ DON'T SPEAK WİTH TALAT , İ ONLY SPEAK WİTH ANKARA !

İs it this meeting is only '' MEZE '' for the presential election in South Cyprus ?

[Bananiot]

How exactly are we fighting for our beliefs? Can someone elaborate? Then, is it not the final result that counts? After the referenda we are left with three times as many settlers as the number that would have stayed, the whole of the Turkish army remains rooted in Cyprus and furthermore not an inch of ground returned. The north is being cemented and the construction boom should be ringing bells for us and most important, the international community, which cannot be left out in the seeking of a solution, has switched alliance and considers the Greek Cypriot side as the intransigent part. Greece has washed its hands and lends oral support to the President and while we rest on our laurels we occasionally "fight" from our armchairs.

This is simply comic!

[Nikitas]

Maybe he realised that since Ankara wont talk to him his only choice is Talat. On the other hand it mgith be an election ploy. Politicians are hard to figure out. Whatever the motives I hope they come out of the meeting with something positive and real and not one of those prefab statements that say "our talks were interesting, constructive blah blah blah" and we are back to square one. Had enough of those.

[Bananiot]

Well, Papadopoulos is very predictable, that is why certain voices in Ankara have expressed the wish he is reelected. He is also very predictable with his incoherence's. here is a recent example:

21/08/2007
The meetings must always have a fixed agenda.

22/08/2007
This is the prerequisite for the meeting, that there would be no terms and prerequisites

The above were uttered by the same man, within the space of 24 hours.

[bigOz]

What happened to Papadopulos ?
He used to say: İ DON'T SPEAK WİTH TALAT , İ ONLY SPEAK WİTH ANKARA !

İs it this meeting is only '' MEZE '' for the presential election in South Cyprus ?

Maybe he has come off his "high horse"! That will upset few in this forum...

[Nikitas]

Bananiot,

There were many negatives in the Annan plan. You point the settler problem, which is probably the major obstacle and the continuing building boom in the north. There were other problems that I have outlined in other posts on this forum. For me the splitting of the Greek Cypriot component state in two by the Dekelia base was very important. In fact the only unitary territory per the Annan plan was the Turkish Cypriot component state with silly provisions for underpasses and flyovers for us to link the western and eastern sectors. Why the insistence that the Dekelia base should stretch from the sea to abut the Turkish sector in the north? In addition there was an absolute insistence by the Turkish high command on armaments and personnel on the island throughout the ten years implementation phase that would guarantee that the Greek side always be undergunned. These things made the plan look like a setup to some, including me, in the asbsence of UN guarantees.

Also the plan did not have even one sentence for the encouragement of Cypriots, of all communities, to return to the island as stakeholders in a future federal state. Plenty for settlers nothing for people like me and others here.

If all this is not enough, the financial burden was all on one side. Like one politician said "the plan is asking us to pay the costs of the invasion with interest".

[ge0rg10]

dont you just get the feeling they (pap and tal) dont want to resolve the problem as they will probebly loose their high paying jobs?

[Nikitas]

Halil,

we must keep in mind the conditions and the times a person has lived through when judging their actions. Papadopoulos and his generation lived through colonial times, the Cold War, nationalist ideology and almost all their adult life on the island. Papadopoulos is a product of his time. One thing that he keeps repeating and is very much in the fore of every Greek Cypriot's thoughts is "viable". This is more than just a figure of speech, it is a way of saying we do not want any of the factors that led to 1963 and 1974 in the future. It is the equivalen to the word "security" used by the Turkish Cypriot side.