Cyprus-Forum.com

[Get Real!]

Get Real, how about we give them Papadopoulos and we get Talat?

They would probably both get lynched and get thrown in a dumpster.

[Get Real!]

Bananiot mate, after the understanding you've shown I don't think you would recieve any bad replies from any of the TCs regarding our mistakes.

The TCs made msitakes???

[Pyrpolizer]

I am glad, for a start, that I have managed to make you two see eye to eye. I thought you were going to tear each other's heart out, a few days ago, over the ... oil, that may exist.

Pyrpolyser thinks that I serve only half the truth, by writing about the shortcomings of my community. He does not think that I tell lies and in general he has not question my "half truths", as he defined them. I thank him for this.

Kifeas, on the other hand, has questioned my "half truths" on many occasions but the only thing he comes out with is general aphorisms of the kind "distortions, exaggerations, twisting of logic and lies". He has often accused me of distorting historical facts but all I write I find in books that one still can freely buy in bookshops. May be, God forbid, if Papadopoulos gets a second term, we would see these books burn in a pile. I have often written about the past exploits of Papadopoulos (his involvement in Akritas, the summary executions of leftists in 1958) which have been thoroughly documented but a bigot he is will never open his eyes to reality.

The fact that Kifeas has a distorted notion about percentages and correctness (you are only 1% so you must be wrong) only stresses his inability to think or function in a rational manner. At the same time this stresses the deep undemocratic character of this "character" who also happens to have a foul mouth which he also conceals behind his anachronistic nationalism.

Back to Pyrpolyser, I can only presume that he carefully conceals the numerous times I wrote about the TMT and Denktash, perhaps in order to press home his point, that is, to discredit me in the eyes of the Greek Cypriot readers, as someone who does not touch the shortcomings of the other side.

I underlined the parts that I want to reply.

b)Just 2 days ago I told you you circulate a lot of rumors and gossips.Therefore yes I wouldn't go as far as accusing you of been a liar without evidence. But you cannot convince me you are telling the truth either

c) I actually made a search for you in this forum. You made 4800 posts and the NUMEROUS times that you mentioned ANYTHING about TMT were 27, 3 of which are your references in this topic. Here's the format of your short replies without further comments:


· Pyrpolyser, I know what I am talking about. We put the bullets into the guns of TMT.
· It takes two to tango chimera. The aim of TMT was to partition the island but the stupid actions of our leaders at the time only helped TMT achieve its objectives.
· The aim was not only to combat TMT but to further the aim of enosis (desirable).
· As a result of its activities EOKA enabled Turkish Cypriot nationalists to set up the TMT.
. Piratis, are you now insinuating that I support the TMT?

And finally a)
Yes i believe you are a distorder as Kifeas said. It is true me and Kifeas had a fight the other day (nobody is perfect )but the fight was not for the "oil, that may exist"

[Nikitas]

Whenever these discussions of past mistakes come up the statement of the late C. Karamanlis comes to mind:

"Give the Turkish Cypriots everything they ask for and then give them a sweet on top", meaning be thankful for what you got re the Zurich agreements. Had we followed that advice would we be arguing about whose fault caused what part of the current snafu?

[T_C]

Bananiot mate, after the understanding you've shown I don't think you would recieve any bad replies from any of the TCs regarding our mistakes.

The TCs made msitakes???

I know we made many mistakes, but (in my opinion) I think our biggest mistakes were after the war and even now we are making many mistakes on our side...

[Pyrpolizer]

Speaking of the "numerous" times Bananiot made any references at all to TMT (even single liners) here's how many references he made for his Anti-Christ (papadopoulos)

Search found 474 matches

[Pyrpolizer]

Bananiot mate, after the understanding you've shown I don't think you would recieve any bad replies from any of the TCs regarding our mistakes.

The TCs made msitakes???

I know we made many mistakes, but (in my opinion) I think our biggest mistakes were after the war and even now we are making many mistakes on our side...

T-C imo your biggest mistake was that you BROUGHT TURKEY HERE.
And that was not simply because the GCs wanted Enosis, it was pre-planed.

This mistake will finally eradicate you from Cyprus, and donate the northern part to Turkey and its settlers.

[Get Real!]

Speaking of the "numerous" times Bananiot made any references at all to TMT (even single liners) here's how many references he made for his Anti-Christ (papadopoulos)

Search found 474 matches

That’s why I often wonder what he’ll write about if TP loses the coming elections; should he then start to attack the new president, Bananiot’s stance will be easily explainable as an anti-government compulsive disorder!

[Bananiot]

So, Pyrpolyser, you think that I talk a lot about Papadopoulos. Just wait until Christofias opens his mouth! You also think that by bashing Denktash and his followers all day you serve your country. You could not be more wrong. We made the same mistake in 1963 and look where it got us. I remember the "patriots" back in the early 80's who decided that a meeting with Denktash was an act of treason and anyone who suggested this constituted a national threat. Soon, however, they were forced to eat their words, just like Papadopoulos, who made mockery of anyone calling for a meeting with Talat, only to send a letter and ask for one as soon as Christofias became a candidate for the top job.

Get Real, I wouldn't like to burst your bubble but I am quite sure that Kifeas has no political vision. For example, he dismissed lightly the effort of Makarios to alter the Constitution and he said that the Turksih Cypriots had only to reject these "suggestions" and we would be as we were. Well, this points to a childish approach to real events that shaped our future and this "I play" "I stop playing" thing is something you encounter only in kindergardens.

So, let me ask a question and anyone can attempt to answer it. If we can agree that we can learn from our mistakes, what are these mistakes we made? It is only appropriate that Greek Cypriots list mistakes made by their own side and Turkish Cypriots mistakes made by them.

[Kifeas]

For those that really want to deepen their knowledge on the recent history of Cyprus, up until 1964, there is a very concise work prepared by Stella Soulioti in her two volume book, “Fettered independence, Cyprus, 1878-1964!” It is not so much Soulioti’s personal views and interpretation of events that matters, but mainly, the ocean of facts, quotations, citations, references and documentation that she provides in the background of her work! I have never come across yet of a work with such a myriad of references to sources, especially on the events surrounding the 1963-64 intercommunal conflict and crisis!

Following her analysis and more importantly her documentation on the basis of mainly British sources and references, as well as that of Kleride’s volume I of “My deposition,” 3 (three) are the most critical conclusions one can safely make!

1. The December 1963 conflict was not due to the existence and /or implementation of the “Akritas plan;” and nothing of whatever occurred this last week of December 1963, as well as afterwards, on the part and on behalf of the GC side, was based on anything provided by, prescribed in, or directed by the “Akritas plan” and /or its content! The “Akritas plan” was never implemented, as such, not even in just one of its phases!

2. The December 1963 intercommunal conflict was orchestrated and initiated by the TMT, which dragged into its trap the already organized and prepared GC paramilitary forces, for the sole aim of “undercutting” any GC plans in a “pre-emptive” way, and then to use them as an excuse to move towards a two-fold parallel undertaking, that of withdrawing from the government on the one hand, and a subsequent Turkish invasion and partition on the other!

3. It so occurred that none of the plans of the two sides, i.e. neither the existing GC “Akritas” nor the also existing parallel TC /Turkish one, have ever worked and produced to the slightest of their aims! The end result, the outcome so to say, did not “vindicate” anyone of the two sides’ assumptions at the time! The “Greek Cypriot” Akritas plan was cancelled out and became redundant before its implementation by the pre-emptive way in which the “Turkish Cypriot” side (TMT) acted in December 1964; and the “Turkish /TC” corresponding plan was cancelled out and made redundant by the fact that it was based on a number of miscalculations! The same miscalculations that they repeated in 1974, by the way of “interpreting” international law and the way the international community would have responded!

What is despicable -along the side of all this mess that was created in Cyprus, not just since 1974 or December 1963, but at least since the beginning of the 1960’s; is to blame it on the ordinary people, the vast majority so to say of the two communities, or to one or both of the communities as a whole! This is more often been observed by many TC posters in this forum, and it reflects the official propaganda line of the Turkish establishment! It is made in order to justify the general, massive and indiscriminate violation of the human rights of all the GC former inhabitants of the occupied north of Cyprus, and to justify why Cyprus should be partitioned in any way, from or fashion!

What is more despicable is to hear GCs like Bananiot that know or they are in a position to know the truth and to grasp the broader picture, to join their voices with the above official Turkish establishment propaganda line, in blaming the GC side, alone and only, in such a comprehensive, indiscriminate and over-generalized way! They go even further with their acrobatics, and join their voices with the Turkish official propaganda in claiming that the Akritas plan -irrespective of the fact that it was never "allowed" to be put into motion or practice, was a plan aiming the “annihilation” of the TC community! And then they have the audacity to cite Dionisions Solomos, as if what Solomos said was that “half and distorted truths serve the national interests!”