Cyprus-Forum.com

[Eric dayi]

Hello everyone. I've been following the discussion, and I thought I would take a break from other stuff and submit a proposed flag. It was tough to avoid red (for Turkey) and dark blue (for Greece) and still have something meaningful, but a lot of foreigners see Cyprus as a sunny beach destination, and the light blue represents the color of the Mediterranean. Yes, the current flag is quite nice, but some of the hardened TCs might have a problem with it. Cheers, Mills

You are wasting your time because Cyprus will never be united, not in this millennium anyway.

Also, there are a hell of a lot of GCs in the South who prefer the Greek flag to the "Cypriot flag" and you should know that.

One sided opinion.... What about the "TRNC" flag ... is so similar with the Turkish flag...and how many of the TC prefer the Turkish flag or have it it next to the "TRNC" one?

That's exactly my argument Lena and why I said it's a waste of time.

People are not going to give up a flag they grew up with and respect and trying to force them into something they don't want will only cause trouble.

The "one sided opinion" was in response to Mills' "but some of the hardened TCs might have a problem with it." statement. What I meant by what I said was that there are GCs in the South who would get rid of the "Cypriot flag" and hoist the Greek flag with pride because they believe "Cyprus is Greek".

There are TC that do not even have a "TRNC" flag...they use only the Turkish one.

Eric, this thread was opened from people they want to see a united Cyprus. They have dream to see one flag that will represent all the island.

If thats not your dream then step back from this one. Ok I do not have a dream that one of this flag will be the future flag but why you want to stop them?

There's a difference between telling someone he is wasting time and telling him to stop. I told him he is wasting his time because like yourself I do not have a dream that one flag will represent us all.

I knew that the one sided reply was for Mills, but since you do not like to talk about your "side" in that way do not do it for the GC as well.[/quoite]

I always talk about my side Lena, that's why people don't like it.



I can see from your post that for you there is no two side thing...for you there is only the Turkish side. Am I wrong?

Yes, you are wrong. I always say there are two sides, GCs in the South and TCs in the North. It was Mills who referenced to one side only knowing
full well that many on the other side also do not want a shared flag.

Tell me something Lena, why did you not ask Mills why he made that one sided remark about us TCs but said nothing about the GCs?

Sorry for the delay, I had a nap

Well you are wrong on few things here. One is I never said that i do not have the dream that one day there will be one flag that will represent us all. If you read Kikapu's report about the two president meeting my name is among the "true Cypriots" as he call us...the ones that want unification.

Now I know what you are talking about, the way you put it in your last posting wasn't as clear as this.

By the way I did not comment on Mills post because I am sure that his comment came from this forum. I was busy for the last few months and did not follow much the Cyprus problem section but from what I understood some TC reacted in a bad way when Sotos (if I am not wrong) posted a flag with something on it. Really I have not seen that and do not know what is been said, but I guess that comment was from that thing. I might be wrong of course. [/quote]

Well, you are wrong in a sense. I was not here either when sotos posted the Turkish flag but I read about it and know all about it. I suggest you dig it out and read it and then maybe you'll understand why the TCs reacted in that way. It was what he deserved and I would have reacted just the same if not worse then any of them.

By the way, I know Mills opinion in some way and I know where you coming from as well. Thats why I reacted with that way

You reacted in that way and he has left you to rescue him all on your own.

Had he referenced to both sides about the flag then I would not have responded to him at all or maybe just said that he is wasting his time.

and as you want to protect your "side" I want to do the same as well,

And like him you were also one sided. I told him there are Gcs in South Greek Cyprus who have a problem with the "Cyprus flag" but I never nevre refuted his comment about TCs having a problem with it either. SO what I said was not exactly "one sided opinion" as you claimed.

but in my case I am trying not to divide the island.

That's because you know that in case of unification, being the majority, a GC will win every election, bye-election and every other election or what ever going every single time because even those GCs who wanted to vote for a TC would be intimidated not to.

Unification is only possible if we TCs agree to be a minority with only minority rights because your people and your government does not want TCs to have any say in the running of the country. If they/you did the CypProp would have been solved a long time ago.

Your government and your people still want the same 13 points changed that Makarios wanted to change and started the attempted genocide war in Cyprus for ENOSIS. If we agreed for the 13 points to be changed then we would be agreeing to becoming a minority in our own country and made to feel like foreigners in a GC state.

You government and your people do not want to give us what is in the original Cyprus constitution/ agreement and we will not accept anything less so unification is impossible. Partition might be hard but has a better chance of becoming a reality.

[Mills Chapman]

Lena, welcome to the CPSP forum! You might have already made some appearances, but it's nice to see you here "where the gloves come off."

Eric, what I was trying to say was that I think there is a greater percentage of TCs than GCs who do not like the current RoC flag. Yes, some GCs, who identify far more with their Greek heritage than with their Cypriot citizenship, may not like the RoC flag and solely wish for there to be a Greece flag. And I do know that there are a ton of Greece flags waving in Cyprus south of the Green Line. But if Cyprus were to be reunified, and I understand that you believe it will never happen, I bet the percentage of GCs who would want a different RoC flag than the existing one would be much lower than the percentage of TCs looking for a change in flag design.

In my earlier post, I was trying to pre-empt the comments of some GCs who would say what is the matter with the current one. I was trying to show my sensitive understanding of a lot of TCs' wishes to change the existing RoC flag if one flag were to represent the whole island.

Perhaps the Garfield cartoon was a bit excessive. Sorry.

[LENA]

Well, you are wrong in a sense. I was not here either when sotos posted the Turkish flag but I read about it and know all about it. I suggest you dig it out and read it and then maybe you'll understand why the TCs reacted in that way. It was what he deserved and I would have reacted just the same if not worse then any of them.

I am sorry i do not have the time right now to go through all the threads to find that ... if you are kind enough to help me I will have a look, if not I am sorry some other time

You reacted in that way and he has left you to rescue him all on your own.

He already reply to your post so I guess you was wrong on that, and by the way I am not here to rescue anybody or defend anybody. I am writing my opinion as you do, and when i see something that i disagree i will say it.

Had he referenced to both sides about the flag then I would not have responded to him at all or maybe just said that he is wasting his time.

He did, he said that he avoided blue for Greek Cypriots (Greek flag) and red for the Turkish Cypriot (Turkish flag). As for the other part of his post...as i already said....he obviously said that because of the recent reaction from the Turkish Cypriots around here.

By the way, Mills I told you before...try to be in our position. You said that TC (majority) dont like the current RoC flag ... well they do not care about any RoC, the only thing they see is "TRNC" and the Turkish flag. But you were right that the majority of the GC is not looking for a flag change. the current flag has nothing to do with religion, is not related with any "mainland" colors and has the whole shape of the island...which symbolize a united island in my humble opinion. But the current "flag of the whatever they call TRNC" resemble the Turkish flag.

And like him you were also one sided. I told him there are Gcs in South Greek Cyprus who have a problem with the "Cyprus flag" but I never nevre refuted his comment about TCs having a problem with it either. SO what I said was not exactly "one sided opinion" as you claimed.

Up to now, they called me crazy for defending the TC. Calling me one sided thats a change. But thank you all your comments are welcome!

That's because you know that in case of unification, being the majority, a GC will win every election, bye-election and every other election or what ever going every single time because even those GCs who wanted to vote for a TC would be intimidated not to.

You never thought that at every election they ask your opinion and not your religion, nationality, background, or whatever. You never thought that some of the GC might go in favor of something that the TCs want and the opposite? Thats why we call it democracy, you are free to vote what you want and it happened to be in secret/private so you will feel free to vote whatever you want. So do not bet your head on that because you might loose it.

By the way, why should we apologize for being the majority? Do you want to stop having children and you start being more productive on that issue so we will be equal if few decades?

Unification is only possible if we TCs agree to be a minority with only minority rights because your people and your government does not want TCs to have any say in the running of the country. If they/you did the CypProp would have been solved a long time ago.

Ok! Thats not an one sided post/comment! Yes I agree...happy now?

Your government and your people still want the same 13 points changed that Makarios wanted to change and started the attempted genocide war in Cyprus for ENOSIS. If we agreed for the 13 points to be changed then we would be agreeing to becoming a minority in our own country and made to feel like foreigners in a GC state.

Somebody is stuck to the past...hello we have 2007....Makarios is dead for so many years now. Agree, he was not the best leader we had...but we moved on from that. Nobody asked you to become our slaves, nobody ask you to give us your heads in silver tray, nobody asked you to give up from your right...but what do you want to tell me by repeating the FACT that you are minority. You were minority then, you are minority now. What do you want? To kill any GC child that will be born from now on?

You government and your people do not want to give us what is in the original Cyprus constitution/ agreement and we will not accept anything less so unification is impossible. Partition might be hard but has a better chance of becoming a reality.

What is in the original constitution that we deny to you? Half of the island? A different flag just for you? What exactly is that?