Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

You and Bir have both tried to bring about an agreement and have faced opposition from both sides so lets move on.

what opposition? and where?

Silence was the strongest opposition he could get. He was almost begging for people to mparticipate. I think DT was the only one that said something like "Not bad" and then silence....Try going back and reading Birs attempt when he poored his heart out and said sorry and asked for the GCs to do the same because if they did not then he could not say any more...He then went on to say plenty....

[pitsilos]

you are dreaming Zan...who in his rigt mind, apart form you and the vips, plural, , wouldn't want a democratic environment...and this was the essence of his thread...but in your haste you missed the whole point

[Kikapu]

Absolutely..Move forward..But you want to reverse to the point that only the GCs get what they want and we are the ones that cop it again. Move on from 74 is what you are saying and that is exactly what the GCs are saying. They blame us for everything and so do you. They want to justify their murdering and so do you. Lets move on then...We have our own state and so do they...They lost out and so did we.. Quid pro quo...Lets move on and get on with our lives. If they do not want to include us in the constitution as the UN has said they should then let us move on. We will not sit back and wait any longer and as they take our land and build on it then so shall we. As they progress then so shall we. As they bitch then so shall we. How did you get on with your thread on the BBf by the way...What a lot of interest you got from the GCs. Did you come to a conclusion???No I thought not. You and Bir have both tried to bring about an agreement and have faced opposition from both sides so lets move on.

Zan, with all due respect, you are a lost cause. If i didn't know better, and I don't know anything, I would be saying, you're getting paid to write all the hate that you do write. Unfortunately, I can think of one other person other than VP who really appreciates what you write. I hope you make them very happy.

As for my BBF proposals. You are quite correct, other than Humanist, not many GC's jumped on it, but what you conveniently left out in your biased statements was, that there were No TC's interested either, and I dragged you into it screaming and shouting ( slight exaggeration ) and I couldn't even get you interested, because it was not the Annan Plan.

Come on now Zan, who's trying to screw who here.!!!!!

[Kikapu]

Zan, if Kikapu was to receive a certificate of exemption from the army from our ministry of defence, and the deeds for 4 donums of exchanged GC land his loyalty would soon change

Is that how some TC's got bought and sold their souls.???

Sorry mrfromng, but that will not do it I'm afraid. ( I know you are joking)

Kikapus whole problem is the military service. he wants a solution at any cost so that he avoids doing it. In a way I can understand him as the 2 years I was forced to do ruined me financially and emotionally.

That's no longer true mrfromng. I can pay the £3,000 and be done with it without having to do the military, so that I don't have to deal with the Americans giving me shit as well as cancelling my American Citizenship for enrolling in a foreign military. I'll be glad to pay the money, if it goes towards helping to bring peace to all Cypriots.

[zan]

Absolutely..Move forward..But you want to reverse to the point that only the GCs get what they want and we are the ones that cop it again. Move on from 74 is what you are saying and that is exactly what the GCs are saying. They blame us for everything and so do you. They want to justify their murdering and so do you. Lets move on then...We have our own state and so do they...They lost out and so did we.. Quid pro quo...Lets move on and get on with our lives. If they do not want to include us in the constitution as the UN has said they should then let us move on. We will not sit back and wait any longer and as they take our land and build on it then so shall we. As they progress then so shall we. As they bitch then so shall we. How did you get on with your thread on the BBf by the way...What a lot of interest you got from the GCs. Did you come to a conclusion???No I thought not. You and Bir have both tried to bring about an agreement and have faced opposition from both sides so lets move on.

Zan, with all due respect, you are a lost cause. If i didn't know better, and I don't know anything, I would be saying, you're getting paid to write all the hate that you do write. Unfortunately, I can think of one other person other than VP who really appreciates what you write. I hope you make them very happy.

As for my BBF proposals. You are quite correct, other than Humanist, not many GC's jumped on it, but what you conveniently left out in your biased statements was, that there were No TC's interested either, and I dragged you into it screaming and shouting ( slight exaggeration ) and I couldn't even get you interested, because it was not the Annan Plan.

Come on now Zan, who's trying to screw who here.!!!!!

Getting paid for trying to protect my people....Not enough money in the world mate..It seems that that accolade could be afforded to you though because you are doing the work of ten Greek propagandists. I think you must be getting tired also because I did not say that I was dragged into it ..But that does not matter much.


It was not any plan Kiks and I am sorry to tell you that at such a late stage...You ignored all the problems and basically said, in simplistic terms, Lets all kiss and make up. Everyone that comes on here with their amature skills on how to cure us of our ailment says exactly the same thing and has this romantic notion that no one has ever suggested this before. Sorry mate but I am a bit long in the tooth to have to go through another one of those. You belittle Koffi Annan and all the experts that put the plan together and then think you can come up with something better. How does your qualifications compare with that of the man. Then a man like Copperline comes along and basically gives us both a slap and because it makes the Greeks look bad they call him all the names under the sun. How arrogant and directional do the GCs have to be on this forum before you find anything wrong with what is going on here. Are you that blind?

[Kikapu]

Getting paid for trying to protect my people....Not enough money in the world mate..It seems that that accolade could be afforded to you though because you are doing the work of ten Greek propagandists. I think you must be getting tired also because I did not say that I was dragged into it ..But that does not matter much.


It was not any plan Kiks and I am sorry to tell you that at such a late stage...You ignored all the problems and basically said, in simplistic terms, Lets all kiss and make up. Everyone that comes on here with their amature skills on how to cure us of our ailment says exactly the same thing and has this romantic notion that no one has ever suggested this before. Sorry mate but I am a bit long in the tooth to have to go through another one of those. You belittle Koffi Annan and all the experts that put the plan together and then think you can come up with something better. How does your qualifications compare with that of the man. Then a man like Copperline comes along and basically gives us both a slap and because it makes the Greeks look bad they call him all the names under the sun. How arrogant and directional do the GCs have to be on this forum before you find anything wrong with what is going on here. Are you that blind?

Annan Plan got a big OXI, so lets not praise it too much shall we.

My plan got ignored, but did not get a OXI.

I can say with a smile on my face, I'm one up on Kofi.

Let me ask you a question. When our good friend Bananiot picks on the wrong doings of the GC's and PappaD, do you call Bananiot names, such as Turkish Nationalist or worse....No I did not think so. So what gives you the authority to say anything to me, if I pick on the wrong doings of some TC's and the "TRNC".

I let the GC's point out their own mistakes, and I do the same with ours. If we are talking the truth and not fabricating anything, why can't we discuss the problems from our side, and let them do the same with theirs. As I was saying on another thread about do's and don't with the Blacks in the States. Whites can call each other "Honky" "White Trash" or "Trailer Trash", but it is offensive, if the Blacks made those same statements, and it is OK if Blacks call each other "Niggers" but Whites can't do that towards Blacks.

I hope you saw my point in all this.

[zan]

Getting paid for trying to protect my people....Not enough money in the world mate..It seems that that accolade could be afforded to you though because you are doing the work of ten Greek propagandists. I think you must be getting tired also because I did not say that I was dragged into it ..But that does not matter much.


It was not any plan Kiks and I am sorry to tell you that at such a late stage...You ignored all the problems and basically said, in simplistic terms, Lets all kiss and make up. Everyone that comes on here with their amature skills on how to cure us of our ailment says exactly the same thing and has this romantic notion that no one has ever suggested this before. Sorry mate but I am a bit long in the tooth to have to go through another one of those. You belittle Koffi Annan and all the experts that put the plan together and then think you can come up with something better. How does your qualifications compare with that of the man. Then a man like Copperline comes along and basically gives us both a slap and because it makes the Greeks look bad they call him all the names under the sun. How arrogant and directional do the GCs have to be on this forum before you find anything wrong with what is going on here. Are you that blind?

Annan Plan got a big OXI, so lets not praise it too much shall we.

My plan got ignored, but did not get a OXI.

I can say with a smile on my face, I'm one up on Kofi.

Let me ask you a question. When our good friend Bananiot picks on the wrong doings of the GC's and PappaD, do you call Bananiot names, such as Turkish Nationalist or worse....No I did not think so. So what gives you the authority to say anything to me, if I pick on the wrong doings of some TC's and the "TRNC".

I let the GC's point out their own mistakes, and I do the same with ours. If we are talking the truth and not fabricating anything, why can't we discuss the problems from our side, and let them do the same with theirs. As I was saying on another thread about do's and don't with the Blacks in the States. Whites can call each other "Honky" "White Trash" or "Trailer Trash", but it is offensive, if the Blacks made those same statements, and it is OK if Blacks call each other "Niggers" but Whites can't do that towards Blacks.

I hope you saw my point in all this.

Absolutly. The difference is that you are standing with the "blacks" shouting back at the whites.

The Annan Plan got the OXI by people that had no idea as to why they voted OXI and were fooled by the crying TPap. That is what Bananiot is so pissed off about. The chance to unite the island and get on with our lives,,,Gone! What you are doing is completly different in that you are apportioning blame on all the TCs where he is blaming tthe government of TPap. When pushed he does take a swipe at a few individuals but then they are collectivelly having a go at him. You only have me to contend with and at a push VP.

The mistake you are making is something that I have highlighted time after time and that is you are not giving any credit to the TCs for doing what they are doing but you find all the excuses for the GCs. Why is that. Do you genuinely believe that we are to blame for everything. Find the balance man. I am pointing out the fact that these guys on here are blaming us for everything because of two reasons. One is that they actually believe what they are programmed to believe and others...and we know who they are...are just here for propaganda reasons. Which category do you belong to.

[Kikapu]

Absolutly. The difference is that you are standing with the "blacks" shouting back at the whites.

Now you make me feel like Gene Wilder in the movie "Silver Streak" with Richard Pryor, where he puts black shoe polish on his face, so that he can pass for a Black Man.

The Annan Plan got the OXI by people that had no idea as to why they voted OXI and were fooled by the crying TPap. That is what Bananiot is so pissed off about. The chance to unite the island and get on with our lives,,,Gone! What you are doing is completely different in that you are apportioning blame on all the TCs where he is blaming tthe government of TPap. When pushed he does take a swipe at a few individuals but then they are collectivelly having a go at him. You only have me to contend with and at a push VP.

So according to the TC's, the 76% of the GC's who said OXI to the AP, were bunch of sheep and allowed themselves to be lead by PapaD's "crocodile tears".

I never knew that there were so many idiots in the South.

Tell me what blame I apportion the TC's and not the GC's Zan. Please be specific, because your "Generic" accusations are getting tiresome to those who want to hear the truth from you.

It is true, that I was critical of Talat of late, because he cancelled a meeting with PapaD, over some meaningless friendly football match, when he should have had his butt in that meeting. Is this the kind of leadership you want me to admire Zan.?? Is not as if Talat is busy everyday, that another meeting has not been arranged since few weeks ago.

Just what does Talat do with his time anyway.?? I always wanted to know this. Perhaps someone can shed some light on this for me. What are his daily responsibilities.?

The mistake you are making is something that I have highlighted time after time and that is you are not giving any credit to the TCs for doing what they are doing but you find all the excuses for the GCs. Why is that. Do you genuinely believe that we are to blame for everything. Find the balance man. I am pointing out the fact that these guys on here are blaming us for everything because of two reasons. One is that they actually believe what they are programmed to believe and others...and we know who they are...are just here for propaganda reasons. Which category do you belong to.

As I asked you before, you will have to give me some specifics where I put the TC's down and praise the GC's. Please be specific.

Do I like the idea of a Partition of my country which is only coming from the TC side by those who want Partition.? The answer is OXI, so what nice things can I say about Partition my dear friend Zan. I'm I suppose to swallow something that I don't believe in. Is this your measure of me being against the TC's and praise for the GC's, because they (most) also don't want to see their island divided. Now we all know who and why those want the island divided, and it has nothing to do with, whether we can live with the GC's or not, so lets not "spin our wheels" here for nothing Zan.

Perhaps I have lived too long in the States, where it is the duty of each individual Citizen to criticize their government and individuals of their "wrong" doings.

[BirKibrisli]

What we want and what the "RoC" that claims to represent the whole island wants are two separate things. It is not us that is saying to you that we want the whole island to do with as we wish but you. We as part owners of the island are saying that Hellenisation of the island is out of the question. The Zurich agreement made provisions to prevent that and the Annan Plan made provisions to prevent that and you tried to either change it so you could do what you wanted illegally or you voted OXI to it against the UN's wishes and aims. Now you and Kikapu and Birkibrisli want to convince us that our lives and identity is safe in your hands and the case is the absolute opposite. This should wring alarm bells in both my "Turkish" brothers heads but they either chose to ignore it or try to justify it. The truth is out there DT and it does not take much to find it when your own officials are telling us what they want. It is the ones on this Forum that are trying to blur the edges. We even know that TPap wants the same thing and lays claim to the whole island as being a Hellenic state so why are you surprised that we fight against it and the UN and the EU see us as being right to do so.

So,my dear Zan,your paranoia has not subsided one little bit,has it?

Please do not misrepresent my point of view. I never said our lives and identity were safe in anybody's hands. I do believe our lives and identity would be safe in a unitary state run on democratic principles,human rights and equal opportunity considerations and the rule of law,under the overall protection of the EU observations and international media attention. I trust in our own ability to stand up and fight in whatever battle comes our way.And make sure our destiny is in our own hands and nobody else's...

Given the lessons we learned from our sorry past,I believe if we concentrate on our similarities and common values instead of highlighting our differences at every opportunity,there will be no need for anyone to try to dominate,prosecute or harm the other.In time Cyprus Hellenism like Cyprus Turkism will become history,and we will go forward as one nation and one people,the Cypriots...As I keep saying,you do not promote peace by isolating yourself,arming yourself to the teeth,and sticking your finger up at your "enemies"". You promote peace by embracing your "enemies" and making them your friends and brothers.And you do that by showing understanding,empathy and compassion.There will be no reason to fear people you love and respect,who in turn loves and respects you...It is so simple really.It is beyond my understanding why people prefer suspicion over trust and understanding,fear over empathy,and resentment over compassion...

[Viewpoint]

What we want and what the "RoC" that claims to represent the whole island wants are two separate things. It is not us that is saying to you that we want the whole island to do with as we wish but you. We as part owners of the island are saying that Hellenisation of the island is out of the question. The Zurich agreement made provisions to prevent that and the Annan Plan made provisions to prevent that and you tried to either change it so you could do what you wanted illegally or you voted OXI to it against the UN's wishes and aims. Now you and Kikapu and Birkibrisli want to convince us that our lives and identity is safe in your hands and the case is the absolute opposite. This should wring alarm bells in both my "Turkish" brothers heads but they either chose to ignore it or try to justify it. The truth is out there DT and it does not take much to find it when your own officials are telling us what they want. It is the ones on this Forum that are trying to blur the edges. We even know that TPap wants the same thing and lays claim to the whole island as being a Hellenic state so why are you surprised that we fight against it and the UN and the EU see us as being right to do so.

So,my dear Zan,your paranoia has not subsided one little bit,has it?

Please do not misrepresent my point of view. I never said our lives and identity were safe in anybody's hands. I do believe our lives and identity would be safe in a unitary state run on democratic principles,human rights and equal opportunity considerations and the rule of law,under the overall protection of the EU observations and international media attention. I trust in our own ability to stand up and fight in whatever battle comes our way.And make sure our destiny is in our own hands and nobody else's...

Given the lessons we learned from our sorry past,I believe if we concentrate on our similarities and common values instead of highlighting our differences at every opportunity,there will be no need for anyone to try to dominate,prosecute or harm the other.In time Cyprus Hellenism like Cyprus Turkism will become history,and we will go forward as one nation and one people,the Cypriots...As I keep saying,you do not promote peace by isolating yourself,arming yourself to the teeth,and sticking your finger up at your "enemies"". You promote peace by embracing your "enemies" and making them your friends and brothers.And you do that by showing understanding,empathy and compassion.There will be no reason to fear people you love and respect,who in turn loves and respects you...It is so simple really.It is beyond my understanding why people prefer suspicion over trust and understanding,fear over empathy,and resentment over compassion...

So in short what you are saying is love conquers all...arent you being super naive when you consider our past? you are asking us to jump into a black hole and expose ourselves to the mercy of the numerical majority. All Tcs want are safeguards to ensure we are not turned into the Pakistanis of the UK and more like the Scots where we have a say in our own future and everything is not dominated and exploited by GCs..