Cyprus-Forum.com

[PEACE]

You can not blame me that I don't want to give up some of my basic democratic and human rights. And you, as a citizen of RC you can have all your rights and responsibilities if you want.

Yes,i can blame you! Tc's can't decide to go and live their house in south now if anyone is living in it ! You are saying "We can give you another house from Tc properites." but you are not letting me to live in MY property!

Also RC must be bicommunal !Now its not ! If i come there to live where is my right of living in a bicommunal RC?

[Greek Cypriot]

Yes,i can blame you! Tc's can't decide to go and live their house in south now if anyone is living in it ! You are saying "We can give you another house from Tc properites." but you are not letting me to live in MY property!

You (or your parents) didn't have to leave in 1974. If you didn't leave you would live in your property today without any problems
Of course your property belongs to you and nothing can change this.

But the current situation with TC that live to the north is more complicated than that. (TC that live abroad and never lived under the illigal regime are a different story and there should't be any problems for them).

As a citizen you don't have only rights, you have responsibilities also. RC has laws, that you and the other TC that live to the north did not and continue not to respect.

After 30 years of beign an outlaw RC doesn't hold it against you and still tries to accomodate you as good as possible.

Now of course you can go to court and demand the 100% of your rights. But you should be willing to comply with the 100% of your responsibilities, like any other citizen, if you do that.

When a solution to Cyprus problem is found, then the refugees that unwillingly live in your property will go back to their home or receive compensation to buy a new home, you can return to your property and we can erase all "debts" from the past and start a new fresh beginning.

[metecyp]

You (or your parents) didn't have to leave in 1974. If you didn't leave you would live in your property today without any problems

Oh come on. Please don't act as if nothing happenned in 1974. Many bad incidents happenned including the ones committed by G/Cs. You cannot blame T/Cs that lived in the south, get scared and move to the north. Nobody wants to live in uncertainity (as you said before) and T/Cs living in the south could not estimate what was going to happen to them, so they moved to the north, there's nothing wrong with that.

As a citizen you don't have only rights, you have responsibilities also. RC has laws, that you and the other TC that live to the north did not and continue not to respect.

I wish it was that simple. Take me as an example. My parents were born in the north in 1950s. Then there was 1974, and division of the island. My parents did not have to move anywhere since they were already in the north. Then I was born in the north, and TRNC was formed (which is a sign of not respecting RC according to you). Now did I or even my parents have any choice in regard to living in the north? Could we leave all our family and friends in the north and move to south in order to start being "responsible and respectful" towards RC? I don't think so. Until recently, not many G/Cs in the south even accepted T/Cs in their communities.

But you should be willing to comply with the 100% of your responsibilities, like any other citizen, if you do that.

If you were so keen on complying with 100% of your responsibilities, you would first anounce to the world that RC as it stands today is not what it is supposed to be and you wouldn't let the goverment of RC pass "Asia minor genocide" type of laws that has nothing to do with what RC is all about.

[PEACE]

Yes i agree with Mete all!

Also i want to add something!

You (or your parents) didn't have to leave in 1974. If you didn't leave you would live in your property today without any problems

Yes,we have to leave ! Please remember Inhabitants Exchange Agreement between the sides ! So all the tcs FORCED to go to North side and all the Gcs FORCED to go to South side.People who resisted to this agreement they sent to south by force ! This happaned to Tcs as same !Also can i say to gc refugees "Why did you leave your properties?If you haven't left than now there won't be any problem."??????? Of course a big "NO."

As a citizen you don't have only rights, you have responsibilities also. RC has laws, that you and the other TC that live to the north did not and continue not to respect.

Yes but i'm not guilty being under occupation!This is RC's problem if it isn't able to govern all the country!

When a solution to Cyprus problem is found, then the refugees that unwillingly live in your property will go back to their home or receive compensation to buy a new home

I suppose we were talking about now !

Maybe you can blame us for what happened in the 60s, and for many things you might be right.

However, the Republic of Cyprus is what both of us were supposed to have, not just me.

You said this! So we are talking about now or if there won't be a solution what will be our rights! Don't forget there won't be RC after a solution!You'll also get your rights in north after solution! But it seems now Tcs and Gcs are in same situation ! After a solution we'll start to get our rights step by step ! This is transition period and this is needed for new order's establishment in REAL !

[Greek Cypriot]

Metecyp, your case is different. But imagine some TC that now lives in the home of a GC refugee and makes money by using GC fields and property and then he comes to the south and he wants to throw this GC out of his temporary home again. What you say is just not fair!

Now your views might be different, but can you honestly say that the majority of TC in 1974 when Turkey invated they did not support this action? The truth is that the majority (not all) TC supported both the invasion and "TRNC" things that harmed RC extremely.

TC are treated favorably by RC. If I was doing what TC did (support the invasion, coloborate with the invator, not paying my taxes, not serving in the military etc etc) I would be in jail for life. RC is making a destinction between TC and GC in this case, and this distinction is for your favor again. So please do not complain that RC doesn't throw a refugee in the street and they give you some other propery temporarily.

[antonis]

Let's get this straight. De jure, RC is the only government on the island, currently under occupation, and that's not RC's problem at all - it's an international problem. In any case, de jure any TC is a citizen of the RC.

De facto most of the TCs do not have IDs and passports, don't have social sec numbers and don't pay taxes, and hence don't enjoy the benefits. They can (re)join RC, accept their responsibilities and enjoy the benefits. Again, de jure the RC is what represents both GC and TC. That's all.

The "exchange" (ethnic cleansing big time) was much more coordinated for the majority of the TC (in 1975) than for the GC (in 1974), I think you agree.

If a solution is found, a new state of affairs is going to emerge. The properties issue is one that has to be settled, and is very important and difficult. It is one of the issues that NEVER will there be an arrangement that will "satisfy" both sides "completely".

The most important feature about the solution should be FUNCTIONALITY. Saying YES to the referendum means not only that we endorse fully the agreement, but also that we will work to make the solution work, and accept without hindrance the concessions made.

[PEACE]

Now your views might be different, but can you honestly say that the majority of TC in 1974 when Turkey invated they did not support this action? The truth is that the majority (not all) TC supported both the invasion and "TRNC" things that harmed RC extremely.

Some Gcs supported also! Turkey used its qurantee right ! But after this turned to occupation!

If Turkey wouldn't come to supply the order may be now all of Tcs would be killed by EOKA-B and Greek Junta!Also most of you would be killed ! Remember 15 July!

If I was doing what TC did (support the invasion, coloborate with the invator, not paying my taxes, not serving in the military etc etc) I would be in jail for life.

We forced to North! Than we established our life here.(not me i'm talking about refugee Tcs).And me ! We are here all our life ! None of my parents and relatives were living in South.All of our properties are here ! MY life is here ! How can yo say this ?

De facto most of the TCs do not have IDs and passports, don't have social sec numbers and don't pay taxes, and hence don't enjoy the benefits. They can (re)join RC, accept their responsibilities and enjoy the benefits. Again, de jure the RC is what represents both GC and TC. That's all.

We have to settle to South to use our rights?? My whole life is here ! As a citizen of RC i'm obligated to go to south to get my rights! RC is equal to South only?

If a solution is found, there is no going back to the situation before 1974. A new state of affairs is going to emerge

Right!

[antonis]

We have to settle to South to use our rights?? My whole life is here ! As a citizen of RC i'm obligated to go to south to get my rights! RC is equal to South only?

I NEVER said that you had to move anywhere. Nobody asked you to go to the southern part of the island. Don't forget that RC de jure is the whole island minus the british bases. Its status is that it is currently under military occupation and cannot exercise its control over the whole territory. The fact that you are not an "active" RC citizen is your choice, your freedom. You can become active if you want (get a passport, work, enjoy social benefits etc). You don't have to live in the goverment controlled areas to do this. That's all to it.

I don't want to discuss this further, 'cause it's no use, in about 50 days we'll have the UCR. The de jure status will change, and we'll have a new state of affairs. Then all these issues will be gone.

[tcypriot]

I cant understand how many gcs still are acting as if they are the only owners of cyprus.Never forget that we're equally the owners of this geography.

Cyprus Republic was a bicommunal republic and if one of the two major communities is not included nothing can represent the cyprus as a whole.It's a comedy that gcs are acting as if they were the owners of the cyprus republic and are giving away some rights to tcs because of their goodwill.Cyprus Republic(R.I.P. 1960-1963) died long ago because of the unreadiness of the idea of cypriotity on both sides especially the gc side that demanded our mainland to be the province of a foreign country(greece) .TCs are not foreigners whose only knowledge about cyprus is lying on the beaches and getting sunburnt.So dont try to fool us that the organization at south cyprus is the cyprus republic.

What is the national anthem of the south cyprus administration by the way?Is it the greeknational anthem or something else.I dpnt say this to hurt the feelings of any gc that believes in cypriotity.But when saying to turkishcypriots things like why didnt you pay taxes or become soldiers in the greekcypriot administration try to be logical.


TCs willfully passed to north cyprus to live freely and dont forget that we were forced out of the cyprus republic long ago in 1963.Also now also there are gcs living in north cyprus by their own wills.

When speaking about 1974 invasion by Turkey take into account also what would happen if the illegal occupation of the Greeks(Greekarmy) in cyprus result in.

[metecyp]

Without getting into the details, I think the root of the problem is the fact that the Greek Cypriot Republic in the south has been representing the whole island (in theory) and its people for the past 40 years, while in fact that's not the case.

Greek and Turkish Cypriots formed a bicommunal RC in 1960, and the bicommunal nature of RC, which was an essential building element of the republic, was over in 1963 for whatever reason.

It should have been more fair for the international community to recognize two monocommunal entities (I'm not saying states) on the island, until a final agreement is reached for a new bicommunal state. This way G/Cs would not feel that they own the whole power and talk about "giving rights" to T/Cs and stuff like that. This would also give incentive to both sides to reach to an agreement and have a real state rather than two entities. Of course, the defintion of an entity should have been agreed upon by the international community.

Unfortinately, international community chose the easy way out and agreed that the majority formed goverment represents the whole island. That's why we're having all these issues right now.