Kikapu wrote:bigOz wrote:Kikapu wrote:zan wrote:
Working case:
My brother is 56 and went to Cyprus for the first time last year since 1964. He was told that he would have to come back to Cyprus within the year to do his service...without fail. Of course he had the option to pay as well. He is quite ill and was also told that if he sent in the relevant papers he would not have to serve or pay.
Zan,
Correct me if I'm wrong, but did I not use your brother as an example few months back, that he was told he would have to do his Military Service until the age of 70, in which you said, "yes but only if he stayed in the "TRNC" more than 90 days". Did he in fact stay more than 90 days on his first visit in 42 years when he was told that he needed to come back, or was he in Cyprus less than 90 days. At the time VP and you were on my case, that there were no Military Service required after the age of 49, if one stayed less than 90 days. VP even stated, that his uncle has been coming and going for years without having to do his Military Service before and over the age of 49 years. He never mentioned whether or not payment was made, but gave the impression that he did not, therefore accused me of just making an excuse for not travelling to the "TRNC" on my last visit to Cyprus.
Were you both wrong with those information, or was it deliberate. An honest answer will suffice. Thanks.
I knew the rules on the 3 months military without any payment and the 1 month military with half the payment (£1,500) and also the No military with full payment (£3,000). I did in fact post all this 6 months ago. My problem was, that the last information given to my brother in London by the "TRNC" office was that, I could be held and forced to do my military service right there and then depending who was on duty at the time, since I was over the age of 49. I suppose I could have bought myself out of it with £3,000 on the spot.
I'll bring extra cash next time.
I'll join Bir when he goes, so that we can both peel Potatoes together.
I do not believe neither VP nor Zan made any deliberate attempts to mislead you. I never knew the rule concerning the 49+ year olds until I looked well into it, after BK asked.
Since we are on the subject of misquotations, what you must understand and accept is that, besides many spiteful comments you had made in the past, the Armed forces in the North do not use the military service as an excuse to do rob people in the way you addressed the issue at the time!
£1500 pounds paid by 15-20 recruits doing a month's service from abroad adds up to nothing, especially after deducting the expense for each individual (equipment, clothing, boots, food, bullets fired in training etc). As I said before, many people abroad pay more to participate in war games using paint guns. Those who would pay the full £3000 number around 1-2 a year!
The real reason such a service is demanded is because it would not be fair on all those kids belonging to worse off families, who had no chance of educating their children abroad, or living abroad in better conditions, accumulating wealth and returning to their country. It would inevitably cause tension and friction with the locals who could then say "why did we have to do the military service and they are getting away with it?". And there is a moral point in that if you think about it. Remember most had to do it for 24 or 18 months not until so long ago. My two nephews have just finished serving 12 and 15 months (Uni graduates serve as ranking officers for 12 months)
Until a settlement is reached, every citizen living within TRNC, or visiting it is obliged to to their national service one way or another. It has nothing to do with the individuals' political beliefs, opinions about the solution to Cyprus problem, or wars. We all know there will be no more wars in Cyprus, so the last one shouldn't even come into the equation.
In other words, any money paid is only symbolic, and a form of compensation (albeit small) for not having to do the full service, while earning all the privileges of the others who had done it. Will you now agree that you were wrong in addressing the payment required as you once did and that it is far from being a "ransom"?
BigOz,
In the context that you have presented, and if I indeed used the word "ransom" in that context, then I can say I was wrong. However, if I used the word "ransom" in a context that the £3,000 would have been needed to pay the "TRNC" on the spot in order to gain an exit visa, or else had to remain behind to do Military Service on the spot, then the word "ransom" was used correctly. I believe my use of the word "ransom" was used for the latter purpose. Most of my conversation with VP and Zan after I came back from Cyprus relating to the Military issue was around why did I not come over to the North, and the main reason was, what was relayed to me from the London "TRNC" office to my brother few weeks before I left to come to Cyprus.
Way before you joined the Forum, we had good laugh on the forum between myself, Birkibrisli and even Miltiades about paying One months payment and doing our service all together just for the fun of it. I had already accepted that, so I had no fears as far as that went. I also knew, that this being my first time, I did not need to pay anything up front but to agree on a date to come back in the near future on what ever length of military service agreed on. So that was clear to me, because I have been chasing this issue for the last one year, even with a politician in the "TRNC".
As far as VP and Zan not knowing the 49+ rules, I have a hard time accepting that, given Zan's brothers situation, if he did in fact stay less than 90 days in the "TRNC" and also VP claiming to have gone to the ASAL SUBE in person to ask, and was told that I did not need to do military service or pay. Someone is not being totally up front here. Perhaps you can ask them as to what had really happened.
I had also several times copy pasted them this site
http://www.mucahit.net/asal/askeralma_ENG.htm
and particularly this point:
QUESTION 3. WHEN CAN THE SPECIAL STATUS MILITARY SERVICE PERSONS FULFILL THEIR MILITARY SERVICE OBLIGATIONS?
ANSWER 3.
A. WHENEVER THEY WISH, THEY WILL BE ENROLLED WITH THE FIRST RECRATS.
B. IF THEY STAY MORE THEN 90 DAYS IN ONE CALENDER YEAR IN THE T.R.N.C.
C. THEY CAN DELAY THEIR MILITARY SERVICE THE LATEST TILL THE AGE OF 49.
Of course, it was totally ignored each time. So I knew from last year regarding the age factor and I had accepted it, and we even made two more calls to the ASAL SUBE early this year just to make sure nothing had changed in the rules, and was told, that there was no escaping either half or the full amount of the money, or no money and doing some Military service. The "curve ball" that threw me off, was what was said by the London "TRNC" office.
I know the military is not getting "rich" on what they charge due to expenses for each individual. My gripe if any is, I did not leave Cyprus to try and avoid to do Military Service but rather it was the circumstances and to be asked to do the service or pay up to the age of 70 years old, to me, is asking way too much. When I corresponded with this particular politician, I had asked him to do away with the whole military service altogether for those living abroad to encourage more to return back to Cyprus and bring their Tourist Dollars with them, to help the TC economy, and I believe it was suggested and was up for some legislative ruling on it, but I guess not much has come out of it.
So, there you go.
When we argued that point Kiks My brother had not gone to Cyprus yet if I rember correctly but having gone he was made to sign a paper that he would return in a year so I made a mistake on what my brother was told. This 49 years of age buisness is something that I did not know about so that is why I stated this to Bir as an update. People make mistakes and I did just that.....so shoot me.
