Cyprus-Forum.com

[devil]

They are more subtle than that. The prices in £££ are already rising in anticipation of the rounding down!!!!!

[Johnson&Johnson]

Quick answers cos I am busy at work today - pls forgive any spelling or grammatical errors:

Militiades
***********
You are missing the point entirely. I gather that you are sick of London, but you should not let your emotion blind you to reality.

Despite the social problems, of which Cyprus also has many (are we not 2nd in the EU per capita for heroin overdoeses ? Rife prostitution, abuse against women, etc etc all very nicely swept under the carpet of course) London cannot simply be compared to Paphos, or any other town in Cyprus.

Yes, I feel that London is a shithole, which is why I escaped from there many years ago and came to live in Cyprus. I would only ever go back to the UK if you put a gun to my head. And even then, I'd try and snatch it from you.

Yes, the QUALITY of life is far better in Cyprus. I could never understand those London charlies who come here on holiday then moan and bitch about the place, preferring to be stuck in some north London toilet hole with only tescos and matalan to amuse them on weekends.

No, I would not trade Cyprus for England again. Never.

But there is no denying that London is a magnet which attracts people from all over the world. Cyprus is not. London is a huge, wealthy city with a myriad of industries and services. Cyprus is not. Billions and billions of pounds, dollars and euros pour through London every single day. London may well be the finacial capital of Europe, if not the world. Cyprus is not.

Millions of people live in London, working in every type of industry and service imaginable. By some estimates, 600 languages are spoken in London by its huge and varied immigrant communities. Jobs are available in every sector and profession. Some of the world's best universities are found in London, or on its peripharies. Some of the world's best doctors, hospitals and medical facilities are found in the city. London has world-famous landmarks, buildings and monuments.

Need I go on ?

Paphos is, umm, a nice place. It's a small town with some tourism (fast waning), light industry and very few professional services. Population must be 100,000 or so. There aren't many jobs there, at least not ones that pay well. If you are a retiree, and expat living off a fixed income from other investments or a local with an extended family and a secure job, then Paphos is a great place to live. But the town is wholly dependant on tourism and (lately) construction. If these twin and interlocked engines of growth sputter then Paphos may have problems.

Therefore the two cities cannot be compared.

It's like saying, Paphos property prices should equal those of Manhattan, simply because it is a nice, sunny safe place to live and Manhattan is cloudy and dangerous and unpleasant !

Paphos property prices will always be well below those of the UK due to demographic, economic and environmental factors. A two-bed apartment in Chlorakas, no matter how nice, will never be the same price as a studio in Maida Vale. End of story.


Dinos
*******

Nice to see someone with a bit of intelligence on the forum. I get a bit tired of reading posts about talcing arse cracks etc, hence my only sporadic postings here. Someone here knows about M3/M4 money supply, I am very impressed !

You do not consider this a collapse ? I think it is. Or at the very least, the beginnings of one. The US housing market is in a death spiral and the bottom is a long way away. Subprime woes will spread and defaults will become widespread. Let's revisit this topic in a year or so.

Your comments on oil noted - do not forget there is a 'bubble factor' at work here too, of about 20%. The price of oil will come down a little once the excess liquidity is flushed out of the financial markets, although the long-term trend is always up due to diminishing reserves.

Bush is a fool - his initiatives are keeping gas prices high as refiners refuse to add extra capacity. I mean what the hell for ? Bush has declared that gasoline consumption must fall, so why should refiners build bigger plants ? ! ! !

Where in NY are you from ? I lived in Astoria for a short while, back in the mid 90's

[miltiades]

J&J , but of course London is the financial capital of the world , no one is denying that and no one is comparing London to Paphos based on such criteria . Population of London more than 8 million compared to 100 thousand maybe ?
Its quality of life that counts . You may well ask why am I still living in the UK. It was never my intention to remain here however events beyond my control have made it impossible for me to move away permanently , you can make plans for your future but all these plans can go up in smoke in seconds.

[Johnson&Johnson]

I feel for you, man

I last about 5 days in the UK, then I crack up and have to come home to Cyprus

anyway I hope your situation will improve soon, and you can come back home to the small island in the big blue

[Southerner]

What amazes me is the attitude of

fewer tourists so we'll put up the prices, fewer people are buying houses so we'll build more

If there is an excess of houses for sale or rent how will putting up the price help sell or rent them

[allanm]

we were told by the bank here to keep our sterling account as it is. as the cyprus pound will be devalued as all other countries that have adopted the euro !

[Crivens]

They are more subtle than that. The prices in £££ are already rising in anticipation of the rounding down!!!!!

Yeah, I thought of that afterwards. Was basically what they taught us years ago in college when companies did dodgy things. In the example they gave us it was putting the prices gradually up before having a sale. Almost as sneeky as that company (Dixons?) who claimed you couldn't get a VHS or somesuch gadget cheaper anywhere else. Mainly because they owned the company (was just a different name they slapped on the gadget as it left the production run) and you couldn't actually buy it anywhere else. And what about that British company that called itself a very Japanese name to help shift units. Was it Mitsui? Can't remember now... very cunning though...

Cheers

[Southerner]

we were told by the bank here to keep our sterling account as it is. as the cyprus pound will be devalued as all other countries that have adopted the euro !

Let's hope you'r right

[paul1978]

I have a 2 bed apartment in kapparis bought for 60000cyp (2005)currently valued at 74000cyp (feb07) having spoken to my mortgage advisor at the bank he anticipates a 12.5% increase in property value, he believes that property is still very much in demand and because other european countries will be buying cypriot property in euro's they will see it still as a bargain as they no longer have to exchange currency.
cyprus is still an under dog in the property market compared to its european relatives.

[dinos]

Dinos
*******

Nice to see someone with a bit of intelligence on the forum. I get a bit tired of reading posts about talcing arse cracks etc, hence my only sporadic postings here. Someone here knows about M3/M4 money supply, I am very impressed !

You do not consider this a collapse ? I think it is. Or at the very least, the beginnings of one. The US housing market is in a death spiral and the bottom is a long way away. Subprime woes will spread and defaults will become widespread. Let's revisit this topic in a year or so.

Your comments on oil noted - do not forget there is a 'bubble factor' at work here too, of about 20%. The price of oil will come down a little once the excess liquidity is flushed out of the financial markets, although the long-term trend is always up due to diminishing reserves.

Bush is a fool - his initiatives are keeping gas prices high as refiners refuse to add extra capacity. I mean what the hell for ? Bush has declared that gasoline consumption must fall, so why should refiners build bigger plants ? ! ! !

Where in NY are you from ? I lived in Astoria for a short while, back in the mid 90's

I'm not comfortable calling a collapse in the housing sector right now because things are too fluid and regional variances can be significant. What I do know (being in a related industry) is that houses over $1M are selling in my territory, as are houses under $450K here on Long Island. The 500K to 800K range is languishing on the market. The area I deal with is taking a bigger hit though. If you're familiar with Long Beach, you'll know all those west-end bungalows selling for @400K (approx) built in the 1920's on wood piling & girder foundations over sandy crawlspaces and riddled by termites, carpenter ants, wood destroying beetles and moisture rot... For the benefit of those in Cyprus, we're talking about 600-700 square foot 2 bed/1 bath jobs on plots about 30 by 60 feet. It's no longer enough to justify the price via proximity to the beach. This area is indeed starting to take a bigger hit than other local areas.

So yes, prices do need to come down, and the degree to which that's the case varies depending on the area. I hear a LOT of real estate agents griping about how slow it is. But the past 5 years, selling real estate was like fishing in a fish bowl. Now, real estate agents can't get by just squawking on their mobile phones all day. Many are untrained in prospecting and the price wars of the near past have not generated much customer loyalty. So they're getting frustrated. Who knows, prices might take a few years to wind down in the most affected areas. But New York is in a good position too - population growth is still positive which eventually impels people into the suburbs. So while the Florida real estate markets for example are getting buggered, NY is slightly down.

The sub-prime thing is another wait and see. But it bugs me that pundits go on financial news programs and dismiss it as no big deal. If defaults occur and cause rating cuts of the securitized issues, that will cause some impressive selloffs. A bunch of hedge funds are on the right side of this one (the two from Bear Sterns notwithstanding) but I certainly wouldn't want to own shares in any MBS dealers until this works itself out...

Interestingly, regarding Bush V. Gasoline...there's an initiative at the moment in congress to increase CAFE standards to 35 MPG. GM and Ford, who opposed every single safety and efficiency mandate I can think of, are up in arms. Toyota, whose average is 34.7 MPG, hasn't made a peep. I think Ford estimated that it'll cost over $6K per car to implement that new standard. Chrysler is finished, and this new standard will bring GM and Ford to their knees if it goes into effect. Time for some popcorn...

Regarding oil prices, it's interesting that the folks that benefit the most are stockpiling dollar reserves - such as the Saudis who are holding something like $1.2 trillion. This is supporting the USD in the currency markets. And if there's a bubble in oil prices, that just means more downside for USD. And more inflation that just won't be reported...

I'm on the Nassau county south shore. I go to Astoria when I need caul fat to make sheftalia. I dislike NY though, and go into the city as little as possible. What do you do for a living?

Cheers - hope you're well!