Cyprus-Forum.com

[iceman]

As long as we are under one Federal Government and that neither state is going to apply Racist, Undemocratic, and Dictatorial rules to the opposing ethnic citizens, and that each citizen have exactly the same rights as the next, then I do not care where the FUCK I live, as long as the name of my country will remain to be called CYPRUS, do you.??

I have analysed and proved in the most accurate and factual way that this was not going to be the case in the anan plan, exposing the Turkish side through the constitution they got vagabond Kofi Annan to attach for them in his failed "solution" proposal!

Here in this post is all the evidence one needs:
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.p ... 054#173054

Thanks god Tassos Papadopoulos saw the devil, and bravely stood up against it, in spite of the efforts of vagabonds such as Kofi Annan, De Sotto and Verheugen to cheat on the GC side and sell us "seaweeds for silky ribbons!"

I have finally exposed the totalitarian, nationalist, un-cultural and opportunist attitude and aims of the Turkish kemalist establishment and its TC cronies, for trying to impose on the Greek Cypriots a status similar to that of the now rebelling Kurdish people of Turkey, whom they deny the right for cultural self-determination in their own country, under the kemalist doctrine of “one state, one language, one nation!”

They wanted in this way any GC that would choose to return back to were they were ethnically cleansed from in 1974 -back to their ancestral lands were they used to have their civilisation and all their cultural, religious, educational and linguistic rights for thousands of years, with their own signature to deprive them from all of those rights! They wanted to deny them their dignity and self-respect, so that they either choose not to return and thus live the 30% of Cyprus entirely as a Turkish province for the TCs and the mainland settlers, or if they choose to return to accept that they will have to be turkified themselves!

This is the diabolical nature of the kemalist Turkish ideology, one of the last remaining fascist, kitsch and banal ideologies on earth in our times!

Thank you Tassos for seen the devil and protecting the history, the dignity and the self-respect of the GC community!

So what about the Greek representation in the making of this plan. Did they sell you out? or should they not have been appointed to this job because they had low IQ.

Kifeas, like it or not it will be another Annan plan that your terrorist Presindent Papad will eventually agree to, and it will not be a lot different to the one that was refused.

They think if they refuse & ignore it long enough it will go away....but it WONT...any other future plan will be more or less the same..
Sooner or later GC's have to realise any changes to this plan has to be negotiated with TC's!!

[cypezokyli]

Kifeas firstly I have to thank you for such a long and detailed post, I must have touched a raw nerve.


.

do you feel proud when you touch a nerve ?

It would take me ages to respond to everything in the post but when I read what you have to say the first thing that strikes me is that you obviously have a phobia against Turks and anything Turkish.

to be honest i dont think you can respond.
if you were in a position to do that you would have, as you did 4000 times before

Please excuse me for trusting 1000s of worldwide experts who prepared the plan which was tailor made to try and meet our unique situation. The GCs side took part in all the negotiations, were they asleep or just not interested?, this plan did not drop from the sky and I have friends who took part in the negotiations, many of the chapters where based on GC representation, discussed and agreed by the 2 sides during meetings and amended by UN.

the 1000 experts did not prepare the tccs constitution
nor did we negotiated it.
actually the tc side continuisly refused to hand in its constitution, till the very last minute.

kifeas did not refer to parts of the anan plan which had to do with the central state. it specifically refered to how the tc state planned to treat the gcs.

You still have problems dealing with the fact that the north state would be run by TCs and not GCs... the plan tries to apply the same conditions and principles in both states allowing for the needs and cultures of each community. This plan was a 2 state BBF not a unity state solution where 80% will quite easily dominate the whole island and ensure that TCs are reduced to the level of just another minority where they have not direct say in their own future.

i think there is a serious understanding problem here.
where in that specific post did you realise what you claim ?
dont worry , in case of a BBF you will have the necessary majority to control the northern state.
that doesnot mean that you have the right to suppress the cultural rights of a minority.


..............
it only takes to admit that the parts that kifeas posted can be changed, as in no way what he mentioned endangers the rights of the tcs.

[BirKibrisli]

An excellent post full of wisdom and common sense , that is why I have such an enormous amount of respect for you Bir . Here are two Cypriots who though have never met , share a dream of a united Cyprus where our people will live next to each other and just as Kikapu , mrfromng and Bir would not hesitate to have me as a neighbour and so would I not have any concerns having them all close by , I would include also BigOz , hot headed maybe he is but certainly a man of principles who would reciprocate respect when asked to do so as he proved himself to me recently. VP has to be included too and so must all Cypriots who want this nation to continue its existence as an independent nation and not least , my dear friend , or advocate , Eliko !!

It beats me,dear compatriot,why people cannot see one very simple point...the way to lasting peace and prosperity is not to insist on highlighting your differences and insist on building more and more castles and arm yourself to the teeth and perpetuate the animosity for eternity....but to make friends and unite with your "enemy" so that noone will have any reason to fear or harm anyone.....I can only shake my head and decide that people do not want a solution,for one reason or another....

[Kifeas]

They think if they refuse & ignore it long enough it will go away....but it WONT...any other future plan will be more or less the same..
Sooner or later GC's have to realise any changes to this plan has to be negotiated with TC's!!

Poor fellow …!
If you and your side think that the total and complete realisation of all human, political and cultural rights of the northern Greek Cypriots can ever be a subject of negotiations with you and your side, and if you believe that there is a chance in a million that a plan with a similar philosophy like that of the Annan plan can ever be permitted by the GCs to be placed on the table, then I see your side remaining isolated for a very much longer time; but more importantly, I see you carrying along with you in this catastrophic downturn your motherland Turkey, for it will not only see the door of the EU from a distance and through a straw tube, but will also be kicked out of the Council of Europe and one day out of the UN!

Continue with your ridiculous ideas and ambitions, and I see your community disappearing from Cyprus one day, and when there will be no TC to negotiate with us but only mainland Turkish settlers! Do stay with the illusion that we will ever accept to negotiate with them the future of our country, and accept them as the representatives (the settlers) of the TC community in Cyprus! In the near future, as soon as your community in the north is reduced to a mere insignificant level, we will just appoint a few TCs in some posts of the RoC, as puppets, and we will claim to the international community that there is no longer a political issue to be resolved other than that of the illegal occupation of a UN and an EU member state!

PS: And do not hope that the leftover of your community in Cyprus will be given any more rights to those you have been preparing for the GCs that would have returned back to the north of their country under the failed and trashed Annan plan! At least now that you have been exposed and have shown your true colours through that constitution, you have given us the moral right to follow the same path, when in the future things will eventually turn in the way I have explained to you!

[bigOz]

They think if they refuse & ignore it long enough it will go away....but it WONT...any other future plan will be more or less the same..
Sooner or later GC's have to realise any changes to this plan has to be negotiated with TC's!!

Poor fellow …!
If you and your side think that the total and complete realisation of all human, political and cultural rights of the northern Greek Cypriots can ever be a subject of negotiations with you and your side, and if you believe that there is a chance in a million that a plan with a similar philosophy like that of the Annan plan can ever be permitted by the GCs to be placed on the table, then I see your side remaining isolated for a very much longer time; but more importantly, I see you carrying along with you in this catastrophic downturn your motherland Turkey, for it will not only see the door of the EU from a distance and through a straw tube, but will also be kicked out of the Council of Europe and one day out of the UN!

Continue with your ridiculous ideas and ambitions, and I see your community disappearing from Cyprus one day, and when there will be no TC to negotiate with us but only mainland Turkish settlers! Do stay with the illusion that we will ever accept to negotiate with them the future of our country, and accept them as the representatives (the settlers) of the TC community in Cyprus! In the near future, as soon as your community in the north is reduced to a mere insignificant level, we will just appoint a few TCs in some posts of the RoC, as puppets, and we will claim to the international community that there is no longer a political issue to be resolved other than that of the illegal occupation of a UN and an EU member state!

PS: And do not hope that the leftover of your community in Cyprus will be given any more rights to those you have been preparing for the GCs that would have returned back to the north of their country under the failed and trashed Annan plan! At least now that you have been exposed and have shown your true colours through that constitution, you have given us the moral right to follow the same path, when in the future things will eventually turn in the way I have explained to you!

So what you are saying in effect is: "a plan with a similar philosophy like that of the Annan plan can ever be permitted by the GCs to be placed on the table", meaning any further UN plans giving political rights to TCs will be rejected by the GCs...

And you are further stating that because of GCs rejecting any plans by UN that are not fully in line with your own thinking, the TCs will be punished further and isolated further.

In other words the UN will side with the party refusing the plan no matter what, and GCs will maintain their status forever. I guess, this belief is fuelled by the fact that you were admitted into EU after refusing the Annan plan.

I hope you will soon see just how wrong this whole line of thinking is, because it was not the UN but EU countries who voted Cyprus into EU - I also believe the TC seats are still reserved there. Putting aside that some EU countries are already making noises about lifting the trade embargo on TRNC, your mistaken belief that UN will keep responding favourably to GCs refusal of their solution packages and punishing the TCs has no basis.

All I can say is time will show - hopefully we'll all be here to see what will happen over the next few years!

[Piratis]

bigOz, If Turks obeyed the UN resolutions as they were obligated to do, then there wouldn't be a Cyprus Problem. The problem exists because the Turks insist on crimes and illegalities.

Beyond that, since the Turks did not obey the UN resolutions, the UN is trying to find different kind of solutions that will be acceptable to Cypriots. For such solution to be found GCs, the great majority of Cypriots, have to agree for it of course.

What did you expect? That you can come, steal our land, ethnically cleanse our people, ignore the UN resolutions calling for the immitiede withdrawal of troops and the respect of the sovereignty of Republic of Cyprus, and then force the "solution" that you like on us without our agreement?

So get it clear in your mind: The only legal thing is the 1960 agreements, and they will remain the only legal thing unless Cypriots accept something different. However Cypriots are not obligated to accept anything different. On the other hand you are obligated to end the illegal occupation and the illegal "trnc", and as long as you act illegally you will face consequences.

[Viewpoint]

bigOz, If Turks obeyed the UN resolutions as they were obligated to do, then there wouldn't be a Cyprus Problem. The problem exists because the Turks insist on crimes and illegalities.

Beyond that, since the Turks did not obey the UN resolutions, the UN is trying to find different kind of solutions that will be acceptable to Cypriots. For such solution to be found GCs, the great majority of Cypriots, have to agree for it of course.

What did you expect? That you can come, steal our land, ethnically cleanse our people, ignore the UN resolutions calling for the immitiede withdrawal of troops and the respect of the sovereignty of Republic of Cyprus, and then force the "solution" that you like on us without our agreement?

So get it clear in your mind: The only legal thing is the 1960 agreements, and they will remain the only legal thing unless Cypriots accept something different. However Cypriots are not obligated to accept anything different. On the other hand you are obligated to end the illegal occupation and the illegal "trnc", and as long as you act illegally you will face consequences.

Piratis have you not realized that we have been "facing the consequencies" as you put it, we have been doing so for 44 years, admittidly there are inconvencies and we are not as rich as the Swiss, but on the up side we have our own space where you have no control over us or pose a threat, the last 33 years are testiment to a peaceful and properous exsistence for both our communities. Your greed for more prosperity than you already boast and loss of land are just "facing the consequencies" for GCs.

[Pyrpolizer]

yOU ARE ALSO GREEDY FOR MORE PROSPERITY. lOOK YOU ARE MUCH BETTER OFF THAN Bangladesh. Why do you want anything better?

Jesus some people are ridiculous.....

Hey refugee, don't be greedy, forget about your lands on which some thieves built hotels making millions, you stay in your rotten refugee camp hole.

[Pyrpolizer]

Now coming back to the point of each and every plan presented to the GCs been worse than the previous one as mentioned by some people in here: THIS IS A FACT. Nobody can deny it.

Starting from the Gali ideas from 1992 where the concept of political equality has been introduced, and despite the so many clarifications from the UN themselves what this is all about, we have people still saying, "hey if we are going to be politically equal inside the Federation, this means we are also politically equal outside of it, so why have a Fedration, let's have our own state !!!

Imo there will not be ANY MORE plans. The Plans presented so far were after almost begging of the GCs and Denktash hardly managing to avoid discussing anything. Each and every plan presented was actully dividing the distance between the two sides, and each time Denktash was setting the goal posts further and further. The Anan Plan was the final result of all these divides.

The Gcs are not begging anymore. The don't ask anyone to help presenting a new plan. The 8th July agreement says everything has to be discussed and agreed. Nothing is been discussed, nothing is going to be agreed.

Like i said the other day there is absolutely no possibility to have an agreed solution within the next 15-25 years. The Cyprob will be solved by itself through sudden moves. Such moves might even come directly from the people, from the EU, from RoC, from Turkey, from bussiness people, less likely from the US/UK and the rest of the world. One of the 2 communities will lose in the end. Who that will be remains to be seen.

[Kikapu]

we are not as rich as the Swiss, .

You can say that again. Actually, you are no better off than Turks in Turkey, or even most Third world countries, if Turkey did not pay for your expenses. On the other hand, like most Partitionist who have gained a lot of wealth from "Haram Land" do not give a shit, because your whole existence is to live of other peoples land. Do you think that makes you a good human being. I really do not think so, but for you, that is progress and prosperity. Yes VP, steal food from others mouths, just so that you can feed yours 10 time more over. Can I use the word GREED for a minute to describe your actions. Do the innocent people that you are taken their food away from deserve any of your actions, what you so called 33 years of peace and prosperity for the TC's, when the guilty few GC's the ones that caused all the problems in the past are the ones that should be punished. This is why I keep repeating the word "HARAM", because you are punishing the other victims of all this Cyprus Tragedy. How ironic is that, that a TC Victim is punishing another Victim, because they are GC from the same country, but you show more loyalty to illegal settlers by even rewarding them with the GC Victims land and food, and you call this peace and prosperity, and you are proud of it. At some point in our future history, God will not forgive for those who are committing these morally unjust acts.

You all know who you are.!!