Cyprus-Forum.com

[bigOz]

c'mon guys, I asked a genuine question. I want to know what chances there are of 200,000 refugees getting there land back, or being compensated, that's all. I don't have the time or patience to study history.

There is no real chance of "200,000 refugees" ever getting their land back from the North at this time. I doubt it will happen in future either - not because Turkey will stop it, but also because no political party who would even consider such a thing would be supported by the TCs in the North. Sad as it may be for many Greeks, and proportionally that many Turks who became refugees in the North themselves, the only solution will have to be compensation. I believe there were proposals to that effect in the original peace or settlement plans.

The above does not stem from the fact that TCs wish to make the most of the Greek land left behind, but from the fear of living in a primarily GC dominated area. Why? Because the levels of trust that will encourage do not exist at the moment. As long as TCs face the current economic embargo and bullying tactics in the international arena that keep getting served to them under the pretence of opposing Turkey's occupation of the North, that trust is getting less with time - open borders or not!

Stop opposing TC trade from the North, allow them some breathing space to bring up the standards of their economy to levels similar to those in the South, and trust will naturally flourish. Meanwhile becauase many who left land behind will not live long enough to see their land returned, it may be a good idea to get financial compensation instead - what good is land or money when you are dead?

[kafenes]

So, from what you guys are saying, it looks like there will be no land returned and most probably no compensation. The TCs also want to be recognised as a seperate legal government and want all economic sanctions removed. To me it looks like something is out of balance. I personaly have nothing to loose and from what I see the last 33 years have been the most trouble free years cyprus has seen. The 200,000 refugees probably won't agree with me though. If I was in their place I would also probably try and make things as difficult as possible for the TCs.

[growuptcs]

kafenes wrote
If I was in their place I would also probably try and make things as difficult as possible for the TCs.

Any civilized or uncivilized person would do the same, but Turkey thinks it will all work out because they said so.

[T_C]

kafenes wrote
If I was in their place I would also probably try and make things as difficult as possible for the TCs.

Any civilized or uncivilized person would do the same, but Turkey thinks it will all work out because they said so.

Would they? Any civilised person would try to opress Turkey and not the TCs....

You opress TCs who will in turn NEVER want to unite with you, when no one wants to unite theres no chance of a settlement. You are stupid if you think TRNC will suffer isolation for another 40 years...

Northern Cyprus Passport Holders May Enter Eight Countries, British Parliamentary Committee Report
Published: 5/19/2007

ANKARA - Holders of passports issued by the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus (TRNC) may enter eight countries, according to a report prepared by British Parliament`s Select Committee on Foreign Affairs.
The report, published on British Parliament`s internet site, said that TRNC passport holders may enter the United States, United Kingdom, France, Pakistan and a few other countries.

Other countries are Azerbaijan, Iran, United Arab Emirates and Kyrgyzstan, said sources.

Thanks to the RoCs tactics, TRNC is on a path towards recognition...all be it in disguise...

[bigOz]

So, from what you guys are saying, it looks like there will be no land returned and most probably no compensation. The TCs also want to be recognised as a seperate legal government and want all economic sanctions removed. To me it looks like something is out of balance. I personaly have nothing to loose and from what I see the last 33 years have been the most trouble free years cyprus has seen. The 200,000 refugees probably won't agree with me though. If I was in their place I would also probably try and make things as difficult as possible for the TCs.

The only thing out of balance here is your blind thoughts kafenes! First of all you talk about probabilities when they are not true. I hjave no data but I am sure compensation was one of the alternatives - I'll find out for you (yet ) seeing you are so Google illetrate!

- The South has been enjoying all the international financial rewards by holding the government for the past 44 years!

- They have been and are making things difficult for the TCs for 44 years.

- Screw the 200,000 refugees - relatives of all the dead women, children buried in mass graves will agree with me that they rather starve than live under Greek rule.

TCs do not trust GCs and will never ever wish to live in an area dominated by a Greek majority - not at the moment anyway. Which part of that do you find hard to understand? The economy of TRNC is no financial burden on Turkey's wealth. They have been supporting it for the past 44 years, in return the least they are entitled to is keep a strong army in TRNC.

If you can see the corellation there, you might even understand why it is important for the TC North to catch up with South, and not depend on Turkey economically. So, any economic sanction favoured by the illitrate in the South will only increase North's dependance on Turkey, and a continual (favoured) presence of Turkish army.

You did not get anywhere in 44 years with economic sanctions, and the whole world is starting to see the other side of the coin. Carry on with your magic ideas and see how far it will get you...

[Jerry]

It sounds to me bigOz as if you believe might is right. The ROC will never do anything that implies recognition of the so called "TRNC". But a little goodwill emanating from the north would not go amiss. How about returning Varosha as a thank you for all the free medical care, employment and electricity you have had from the Greek Cypriots over the years. You are mistaken if you believe that economic equality will help resolve our differences. Turkey does not give a shit about the TCs, it wants a base on the island, it wants to poke anything Greek in the eye and it wants a cause celebre to divert public attention from its own political and economic problems. Your grasp of the current situation is seriously flawed, direct trade is not such a big issue since if they want to TCs can export through the ROC and anyway tourism is potentially much more important than trade. Direct flights not direct trade is what you should be asking for. It always amuses me when people bleat on about being a poor victimised minority in order to elicit sympathy but yet assert the "fact" that they (an 18% minority) are equal to the majority - make your bloody minds up, what are you victims or victimisers?

[Murataga]

It always amuses me when people bleat on about being a poor victimised minority

Show me where any TCs claim they are a minority? Show me where in any part of the original constitution of the RoC that refers to/classifies/handles the TCs as a minority? Greece is approximately 5% of the EU`s population, are they a minority in the EU?

[Piratis]

c'mon guys, I asked a genuine question. I want to know what chances there are of 200,000 refugees getting there land back, or being compensated, that's all. I don't have the time or patience to study history.

There is no real chance of "200,000 refugees" ever getting their land back from the North at this time. I doubt it will happen in future either - not because Turkey will stop it, but also because no political party who would even consider such a thing would be supported by the TCs in the North. Sad as it may be for many Greeks, and proportionally that many Turks who became refugees in the North themselves, the only solution will have to be compensation. I believe there were proposals to that effect in the original peace or settlement plans.

The above does not stem from the fact that TCs wish to make the most of the Greek land left behind, but from the fear of living in a primarily GC dominated area. Why? Because the levels of trust that will encourage do not exist at the moment. As long as TCs face the current economic embargo and bullying tactics in the international arena that keep getting served to them under the pretence of opposing Turkey's occupation of the North, that trust is getting less with time - open borders or not!

Stop opposing TC trade from the North, allow them some breathing space to bring up the standards of their economy to levels similar to those in the South, and trust will naturally flourish. Meanwhile becauase many who left land behind will not live long enough to see their land returned, it may be a good idea to get financial compensation instead - what good is land or money when you are dead?

BigOz, occupying our lands and properties and violating out human rights is the worst kind of disrespect. As long as you continue doing that, then you will continue to be our enemies and you will continue to face the consequences of your illegal actions. It is as simple as that.

If you believe the Cyprus problem can be solved with compensations, then we would be very glad to buy all your properties at current market values (or even higher that) so you can move out of our island and go buy nice properties elsewhere. If thats OK for you, great. For us selling off our homeland has never been and will never be an option.

[Piratis]

It always amuses me when people bleat on about being a poor victimised minority

Show me where any TCs claim they are a minority? Show me where in any part of the original constitution of the RoC that refers to/classifies/handles the TCs as a minority? Greece is approximately 5% of the EU`s population, are they a minority in the EU?

EU is not a country. You didn't know that? EU is a union of countries. The unit (member) of EU is a state, not a citizen. In countries however the unit is the citizen. Can you show me any democratic country that the unit is not the citizen but the ethnic group? The regime that South Africa used to have maybe? Thats what you have in mind for Cyprus?

[Murataga]

Can you show me any democratic country that the unit is not the citizen but the ethnic group?

Of course EU is not a country, it is a political partnership "union". RoC was a political partnership "state" where the communities chose their own representatives and dealt with their communal issues on their own. The reason for this was that there did not exist a nation (as there usually would in the conventional defintion of a state) when the RoC was establisehed, it never existed before and it does not exist today. So, in short, the answer to your question is: Republic of Cyprus 1960-1963.