Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

Here is your answer in great depth:

First of all I have to make something very clear:

I believe that we should leave the past behind, we should forgive each other, stop all illegalities and move ahead with a united democratic country without racist discriminations and with respect to the human rights of all Cypriots.

Unfortunately I notice that there some people that insist on using a tiny and selective part of the past as an excuse for the continuation of illegalities and their demand for a "solution" that will be based on racist discrimination of people based on their ethnic background (which is something that exists in no democratic country in the world)

To those people Greek Cypriots deserved the violations of their human rights for the last 32 years and they deserve to be convicted for eternal violation of their human rights in a country that discriminates against them because of their race.

The fact is however that Turks in Cyprus have committed 100 times more crimes against Greek Cypriots than the other way around.

Greek Cypriots have been the majority on the island of Cyprus for 3000+ years. Their interaction with Turks starts in the 15th century, were the Turks attacked our island. This also answers the question "Who started it" for anybody that thinks that this is important:

Throughout the period of Venetian rule, Ottoman Turks raided and attacked at will. In 1489, the first year of Venetian control, Turks attacked the Karpas Peninsula, pillaging and taking captives to be sold into slavery. In 1539 the Turkish fleet attacked and destroyed Limassol. Fearing the ever-expanding Ottoman Empire, the Venetians had fortified Famagusta, Nicosia, and Kyrenia, but most other cities were easy prey.

In the summer of 1570, the Turks struck again, but this time with a full-scale invasion rather than a raid. About 60,000 troops, including cavalry and artillery, under the command of Lala Mustafa Pasha landed unopposed near Limassol on July 2, 1570, and laid siege to Nicosia. In an orgy of victory on the day that the city fell--September 9, 1570--20,000 Nicosians were put to death, and every church, public building, and palace was looted. Word of the massacre spread, and a few days later Mustafa took Kyrenia without having to fire a shot. Famagusta, however, resisted and put up a heroic defense that lasted from September 1570 until August 1571.

So now it is clear how the interaction of Turks with Greek Cypriots started in Cyprus, and the question "Who started it" is answered as well.

What followed were 300 years of Ottoman rule in Cyprus. During these 3 centuries Greek Cypriots were oppressed second category citizens. They had to pay multiple times the taxes of muslims and their testimony in courts was not accepted. Whenever they tried to revolt against their oppressors they were slaughtered.

So here we have a period were Turks were oppressing and killing Greeks in Cyprus. The result of this period was 300 years of oppression against GCs and 10s of thousands of Greek Cypriots dead.

The next "round" of conflict between the two communities was at the end of the British rule in Cyprus, and then from 63 to 68. During this period extremists from both sides were committing crimes and atrocities.

This is the only period that TCs remember, but even here they remember only their own casualties and not the crimes that they had committed against GCs.

So this is a period were both sides had about an equal number of casualties, some 100s for each side.

Then in 1974 the illegal coupists overthrow our president and Turkey found the excuse to invade Cyprus. No TC was killed by the coupists before the invasion had started, but only after.
The result of the coup/invasion was 6000 GCs dead and 200.000 GCs ethnically cleansed. On the other side the TCs had only a couple of 100s of victims.

The next period is the 32 years of illegal occupation and insistence from Turkey to violate international law and human rights. This continues until today.

Conclusion:
1) The Turks "started it" in the 15th century
2) The Turks have committed much much more crimes against Greek Cypriots.
3) The Turks insist on their crimes today
4) Greek Cypriots have committed crimes as well, but only a tiny fraction of the crimes that the Turks have committed.

Still, Greek Cypriots are more than willing to put all these behind as long as we are not provoked by people that remember only the 1% of history that suits that in order to prove that Greek Cypriots are the evil people that deserve even more crimes against them.

Therefore I ask from people on this forum to either:

1) Leave the past behind. Do not try to excuse crimes and illegalities in 2006 with events that happened in the past. Concentrate on how we can find a solution that will respect all Cypriots equally without racist discriminations and human right violations.

Or, if doing (1) is impossible for you then at least:

2) If you believe that the past should be used to determine who is the "good" and who is the "bad" one and that this should be the basis of solving the Cyprus problem (instead of democracy, human rights and legality, that I propose) then at least use the whole history and not the tiny bits that suit you.

[wolf]

I think I just ask very simple Q. Reading all the replays and bit disopointed.First of all piratis you got no right to respond because you never been to TRNC or maybe you did but don`t want to say it I don`t know.If you want to add something please say never been there and never want to go simple as that and I think turkish_cypriot is right you just doing propaganda... Anyway I hope one day you come to NC and can see that everything is not the way you think in your mind.Please don`t take this as a negative way I just ask how GC feels when they come to North Cyprus. Thanks again

wolf

[Piratis]

Anyway I hope one day you come to NC and can see that everything is not the way you think in your mind.

It is not the way I think? So if I will come I will see that the legal residents (a majority of them being Greek Cypriots) have not been ethnically cleansed, I will not see the mainland Turkish settlers that Turkey brought to replace them, I will not see foreigners occupying our homes, I will see the flag of Republic of Cyprus flying and not the one of the occupation force...? Are you sure? I have not crossed the green line, but I can see enough by looking from here. You even created a huge flag on the mountain to remind us of the crimes you continue to commit against us.

[denizaksulu]

There is one truth and that you are boring. Keep on hiding behind Europas skirt and you will be safe.

[wolf]

what can I say piratis
just dream on!!! maybe one day in our life time(which is very unlikely) you can see that what you dreaming for... thanks anyway


wolf

[askimwos]

I have visited the occupied areas 3 times and in all these I have been accompanied by TC friends. Every single time I visited I was shocked by how obvious was the occupation. In every corner, one could see turkish flags, military camps and all gave me the sense of a militaristic regime.
I know that some TCs will say that they do not feel like this and that I am biased, however, this was how I felt during every single visit. I know that TCs may got used to the presence of nationalistic symbols in every aspect of their life, but for me it was something new and I do not really know if I could ever get used to this sort of thing.
Maybe my leftist background makes me to detest anything that is closely linked to nationalism and chauvinism, nevertheless, the atmosphere was very intimitating, maybe, not in a directly aggressive way but it gave you the sense that TCs live on a staged backround that never let you relax and feel really free.
The massive scale at which art is employed to stage this backround was also something that created a negative feeling at the back of my mind. I lost count of the monuments dedicated to Kemal Attaturk, as if that person had anything to do with Cyprus, and to worship turkishness and the turkish army.
Going back to the original question, I cannot say that I felt directly threatened, and I have not observed any bad behaviour from our TC compatiots. Maybe the fact that I was always in the company of really close TC friends helped and made me more relaxed. Getting to meet other TC people clearly also helped as I believe that the majority of our TC compatriots are equally, if not more, friendly and hospitable.
It has been more than 6 months since the last time I visited but I intend to go again in order to see people that I really care about.

[Viewpoint]

I have visited the occupied areas 3 times and in all these I have been accompanied by TC friends. Every single time I visited I was shocked by how obvious was the occupation. In every corner, one could see turkish flags, military camps and all gave me the sense of a militaristic regime.
I know that some TCs will say that they do not feel like this and that I am biased, however, this was how I felt during every single visit. I know that TCs may got used to the presence of nationalistic symbols in every aspect of their life, but for me it was something new and I do not really know if I could ever get used to this sort of thing.
Maybe my leftist background makes me to detest anything that is closely linked to nationalism and chauvinism, nevertheless, the atmosphere was very intimitating, maybe, not in a directly aggressive way but it gave you the sense that TCs live on a staged backround that never let you relax and feel really free.
The massive scale at which art is employed to stage this backround was also something that created a negative feeling at the back of my mind. I lost count of the monuments dedicated to Kemal Attaturk, as if that person had anything to do with Cyprus, and to worship turkishness and the turkish army.
Going back to the original question, I cannot say that I felt directly threatened, and I have not observed any bad behaviour from our TC compatiots. Maybe the fact that I was always in the company of really close TC friends helped and made me more relaxed. Getting to meet other TC people clearly also helped as I believe that the majority of our TC compatriots are equally, if not more, friendly and hospitable.
It has been more than 6 months since the last time I visited but I intend to go again in order to see people that I really care about.

Thank you for the honest response. Im sorry you felt a bit uneasy visiting the TRNC but as you say we are so used to the monuments and flags that we no longer notice them or do they play a big role in our daily lives. We also feel uneasy in the south as the language barrier and air of tension is very evident especially when GCs realize you are TC and reside in the North. I have even been refused service by a shop assistant, she stated that you live in the north we have nothing to sell you, so my daughter who was with me became very annoyed was about to tell her where to put her goods I had to quickly pull her out of the shop for fear of things escalating. You to have army presense, maybe they are better concealed than ours but we know they are there. Your greek flags and "RoC" are also displayed all over the place, so really its pretty much the same for both our communities. We all feel a hugh sigh of relief when we go home just as we cross the border back to where we belong safe and sound.

[denizaksulu]

Askimwos, all of those military camps were once National Guard camps. Did you in all honesty think that we were going to let them remain vacant after they were deserted? Why were they there in the first place?

[Sotos]

VP, how do you feel living among the Totally Retarded Nonstop Cocksuckers (TRNC)?

[zan]

VP, how do you feel living among the Totally Retarded Nonstop Cocksuckers (TRNC)?

Oh! I get it

I wonder if I can think of one for the "RoC"...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................Nope, can't think of one. Sorry Sotos, I cannot return the compliment.