Cyprus-Forum.com

[boulio]

http://www.simerini.com.cy/nqcontent.cfm?a_id=181634

[-mikkie2-]

I think this is another thing that Tassos has in his armoury. The British know this. They do not want to loose the bases in Cyprus and for that reason they will not rock the boat in Cyprus.

For now, the status of the bases will not be questioned. If the British make a wrong move then you can bet all your money that Cyprus will go for the jugular in the EU courts.

For those that can't read greek, the article in Simerini was about the villages that are within the bases areas and that the bases commander will not allow infrastructure improvements to these villages and will not allow villagers to build on their land. The upshot of all this is that the villagers see their human rights to be compromised and so they are planning to take their individual cases to the ECHR.

[brother]

I find that quite inappropriate that the bases commendar acts in this manner, good luck to the villagers in their cases at court.

[turkcyp]

I think this is another thing that Tassos has in his armoury. The British know this. They do not want to loose the bases in Cyprus and for that reason they will not rock the boat in Cyprus.

Then I would say, T-Pap is playing with fire again. RoC can claim nothing about the bases. They are sovereign areas, and are part of UK. The bases are lost to UK for good with the establishment of RoC.

The only thing RoC can do is to create a international political scene like Spain is creating over Gibraltar. But at the end RoC is at the mercy of UK to get the bases back. In Gibraltars case even UK is willing to hand it over to Spain, but the people in Gibraltar refuses to be a part of Spain instead of UK.

But I do not think that UK will let the bases go, as far as their geo-political importance does not diminish.

So good luck I would say to RoC. As a TC though I like it. Anything T-Pap does to make the external world irritated is beneficiary for me. Keep the attitude T-Pap.

[boulio]

does the treaty of establishment and guranteror make the british bases sovergin territory because for some reason or another before the annan plan was voted on and people were discussing it the topic always came up that the british bases as part of the annan plan would be permanent.if they are soverign territory why did the keep bringing it up and why would there need to be a whole seperate clause if all the treatys are already included,unless the british label them as sovergnin.

[turkcyp]

does the treaty of establishment and guranteror make the british bases sovergin territory because for some reason or another before the annan plan was voted on and people were discussing it the topic always came up that the british bases as part of the annan plan would be permanent.if they are soverign territory why did the keep bringing it up and why would there need to be a whole seperate clause if all the treatys are already included,unless the british label them as sovergnin.

Treaty of establishment Article 1 and 2 deals with the basis, (one of the 3 treaties that gave rise to the existence RoC)

I also do remember the same discussions before the Annan Plan. I think UK sovereign bases are a sore issue for GCs as well so they want it back. But legally they can do nothing about it to get it back.

But I think I remember UK were willing to give up some land from the bases or was willing to give up one of the bases in return if ten GC side accepts the referendum.

I think this was a discussion. That is why if I remember correctly if the Annan plan had passed the GC state would not only be getting land from north but also getting land from UK as well.

But this last info I am not sure about it. You better check it out from others.

Take care,

[-mikkie2-]

The status of the british bases is that they are leased from the RoC. They are not british territory like the falklands for example. The term 'sovereign' means that Cyprus laws would not prevail in the SBA areas, but rather British or British Army laws would. Also, the British are supposed to pay the RoC and annual fee for their use. They haven't been paying this since 1964!

The Annan plan actually made the bases into british territory. They would be part of Great Britain. The cosequence of this was that the British would get sea shelf rights as well. So, you can imagine that when oil is found, the British will claim a percentage of that oil revenue as well. Both the TC's and the GC's should be against this move. The price of the British giving back some of this land is that the remainder will become UK territory for ever.

[boulio]

i think you maybe right mikke thats why the british were hell bent about the annan plan so they could solidify there interest ahead of all the cypriots interests.greek and turkish cypriots that is.i have heard about the lease and they payments are do since 1964 and i thinkt the article i posted mentions that.

[turkcyp]

The status of the british bases is that they are leased from the RoC. They are not british territory like the falklands for example. The term 'sovereign' means that Cyprus laws would not prevail in the SBA areas, but rather British or British Army laws would. Also, the British are supposed to pay the RoC and annual fee for their use. They haven't been paying this since 1964!

The Annan plan actually made the bases into british territory. They would be part of Great Britain. The cosequence of this was that the British would get sea shelf rights as well. So, you can imagine that when oil is found, the British will claim a percentage of that oil revenue as well. Both the TC's and the GC's should be against this move. The price of the British giving back some of this land is that the remainder will become UK territory for ever.

Either you are right or I am right. Please show me some legal document saying that UK was paying lease on bases....

To my knowledge and every document that I have read talks about UKs sovereignty over the bases. And when you are sovereign over something you usually never pay anything for it (just like Falkland, no difference). Unless there were some other payments made by UK to RoC because of the services RoC provided to bases. Because under the 1960 agreements RoC not only accepts the sovereignty of basis but pledges to provide all the services necessary for their contoured operation.

One thing we have to realize is that, before 1960 all Cyprus was under the sovereignty of UK. With the 1960 agreements, the sovereignty over the whole Cyprus is left to RoC with the two exception of the basis. So technically they are still under UK sovereignty.

But again, this is what I know, and one should not talk so highly. Please let me know what you mean by lease and please also show the articles in the treaty relating to this lease.

Take care,

ARTICLE 1
The territory of the Republic of Cyprus shall comprise the island of Cyprus, together with the islands lying off its coast, with the exception of the two areas defined in Annex A to this Treaty, which areas shall remain under the sovereignty of the United Kingdom These areas are in this Treaty and its Annexes referred to as the Akrotiri Sovereign Base Area and the Dhekelia Sovereign Base Area.

ARTICLE 2
1. The Republic of Cyprus
2. The Republic of Cyprus shall co-operate fully with the United Kingdom to ensure the security and effective operation of the military bases situated in the Akrotiri Sovereign Base Area and the Dhekelia Sovereign Base Area, and the full enjoyment by the United Kingdom of the rights conferred by this Treaty.

[-mikkie2-]

Ok Turkcyp,

The truth I think lies somwhere in between.

The bases are deemed UK territory on the condition that they remain in military use only. Under no circumstances are the bases to be used for civilian purposes. The agreement is such that if the UK did not wish to retain military facilities in Cyprus then the territories under the control of the UK would be transferred to the RoC. The leasehold thing is a misconception which I fell into.

The UK government however was obliged to give aid to the RoC, which would have been reviewed every 5 years. I think it is this aid that ceased to be paid after 1964.

The following link gives more info regarding the status of the bases.

http://www.kypros.org/Constitution/English/appendix_o.htm