Cyprus-Forum.com

[shahmaran]

:yawn:

[LENA]

:yawn:

Sorry my child...get your F and go to bed until next year that you will have to come back to pass the exams again!!!



You dont know how much you entertain me with your attitude!!! You run out of arguments canimin?



Tata!!!

[zan]

Lena

VP and I have never argued with the fact that if all things were equal that we would argue against unification. The fact of the matter is that so much work has to be done in order to get to a point when either of us could see it as being a viable solution. We see every day and more and more is being done to the detriment of unification that common sense says that that is the only option left. As you say the idea that it could happen is many years away and we can only talk for what is going on today. As quickly as you made up your mind, by speaking to a few young people that it is possible, we have come to our conclusion after, in my case, three years of talking to people on both sides. I am more than happy to accept your version of an isolated event that you experienced and am more than happy for it to happen, it is just that my experience tells me different. Miracles can happen though. I am also more than happy for you and people that think like you not to lose your hope because I have seen too many people turn from how you think to toeing the party line that is sure to impose partition on you whether you like it or not.


The problem I have with many that refuse to see the TC part of this is that you guys have no fear of losing your culture and your identity. At most you are losing a house or a piece of land. We are fighting for our very existence here and the term "Cypriot" simply does not cover this. Whether people like it or not there is no "Cypriot" as a single entity. Yes we have many similarities but we also have many unique qualities that say I am a Turkish Cypriot. Nothing can change that and I don't want it to. No one can take away the fact that the Turkish part of my Cypriotness exists. By taking that word and my identity away dose no justice to who and what I am. You can only add to that as in now, I am a British-Turkish- Cypriot. If I move to the US, I will be an American-British-Turkish-Cypriot and so on. You cannot take away but only add.

No pain, no gain. Zan I agree that there are lots of thing that we need to do. But we have to do them …not sit there and argue because we have to do those things.

You are talking about facts. Well the fact is that GC are more than the TC…that is a fact. What you want us to do…stop getting married, having children and wait for the TC until they become equal with us? Tell me when the TC was equal with GC…and I am only talking in the matter of numbers…TC was a minority in Cyprus since ever

As many years as I have to wait and fight I will sacrifice them but I will not accept the partition…I prefer to stay like that than give up from my country. Because is that how I feel accepting the partition. I am not going to accept the legal division of my country. You can call me too optimistic, dreamer, stupid…anything you want … but that’s how I feel…and since I talk with other compatriots of mine and agree with me…yes I will not change my mind and I will keep dreaming. I usually like to think about the present and what I have at the moment…but I am not going to ignore the future. I will do everything that I can for the best of my country…and trust me I am working on something in my area…If I succeed, I will let you know. But the whole idea of unification, if it will happen one day, we have to work from now. Get along with each other from now. It will be difficult to accept each other one day from one day to the other.

By the way is not the first time that I talk or heart stories and opinion from TC and GC. I lived all my life with GC talking about those things and my dad has lots of TC friends and he is a refugee and he used to invite them home…and he still does since the “borders” opened. But I didn’t pay much attention then. And we have a friendly TC family that live in Potamia…that village has lots of TC. So I had lots of TC around me for years now. But I am talking about young people, the future citizens of Cyprus. People like Shah and some GC friends make me believe that things was more difficult than I was hopping but now my hopes are even more stronger and I believe that one day I might see my dreams come true.

You know what Zan I am Cypriot and in Cyprus we have 3 languages. Greek, Turkish and English. I know two of them…and as Cypriot I decided that I have to learn Turkish as well. That doesn’t mean that I will become Turkish more now than I was before. I don’t change my Cypriotness as you said but I don’t add anything else. I live in UK at the moment and I do speak their language …. That doesn’t add the British part on my nationality, even if I was living here for years. I didn’t born here, I didn’t grow up as British and I will never change the Cypriot part of me…whenever I go. I am sorry but for me there is the Cypriot nation. And I am part of it.

Lena
I am sorry but you accuse me of not seeing both sides of the story when it is you that are guilty of that fact. You seem to have accepted that the island of Cyprus is a Greek based one and I should just become part of it as a Cypriot. The history of this island is far too complicated for me to do that and as I stated many times before I am fed up of explaining to people that I am not Greek because I come from Cyprus. You are far too eager to put us into a minority status with Greek values. We have been living for nearly half a century as proud Turkish Cypriots and for us to give that up at the toss of a hat is something that is not going to happen. The fact that if events of the 60s did not happen then there would be much more Turkish speaking Cypriots still on the island is a fact that many have tried to deny but I believe that that would have been the case so the numbers of today are a distorted reality that must be addressed. I also take great offence to you saying that I dance to different tunes. There is only two ways that anything will be decided in Cyprus within peaceful means and that is either our proper place within the infrastructure of Cyprus with all the past events catered for or a slow but steady push for recognition of the TRNC/KKTC by us. The other option is war coming from the RoC side. We have no aspirations to take over the whole island but the RoC has and that is the direction that war will come from just like in the 60s.

Zan what is wrong with you? Where did I say that Cyprus is Greek based? Where did I say that? If you are talking about the language…well since I believe that can you tell me why I am bothered to learn Turkish? Do you think that I enjoy trying to pronounce or understand why its been written like that and not like another way? Did I ever said that you are Greek? You don’t have to explain to me anything and I don’t care about you have to do that for others…don’t blame me or Cyprus for that. I am sorry to put you into a minority status but you are a minority…I don’t put you in that position because I want to. That is a fact….and facts can not change. Why you will give up from being proud Turkish Cypriot if you will live with us in a united country? If events of the 59, 60s and 70s GC didn’t happened was going to be over a million. But time can not go back. What is your point Zan? Do you want to go back? Do you want to stick in the past? Do you think you can change anything by this attitude?

I am sorry if you felt offended, it was not my intention and I am sorry if I made you feel that way. What I meant it was that one time you say how much you want to live with us and the very next moment how impossible is the unification. I learn that if you want something you fight for you don’t give up and say it’s impossible. One moment you say how much you suffer from us and that TC was the victim and the very next moment you say that I don’t hear both sides.

You know what Zan. Your solutions doesn’t include GC with any good way…you want us out of your future … how you can say that you want us?


Tell me do you want us? Do you conceder us as your compatriots?

I want to be a billionaire but I am sensible enough to know that it is not going to happen. That is the same as wanting a united Cyprus but knowing that we cannot achieve it unless many changes are made. These changes are needed from both sides, yes, but the RoC are the ones that are claiming to represent the whole country and should make the road clearer. I hope you have understood what I am saying this time. You seem to go into defensive mode every time I have a go at the RoC. If there were nothing wrong then I would have nothing to have a go at.

The point about if things were not as they had been in the 60s, there would be many more TCs on the island is because the conditions for the GCs were not the same. I know many TCs that moved back to Cyprus and because of embargoes could not make a living and had to move back to their host countries. This is not the same for the GCs that moved back and all the ones that did move back are still there. Put simply, the TCs did not have the same opportunities so most did not even make the move. In fact many more moved out. You cannot apply the same logic to both communities.



There is also a difference in BEING a minority and having a minority status in the political world. I hope you can understand what I am saying.

[shahmaran]

You are probably wasting your energy Zan!

She will just read something totally different

[zan]

You are probably wasting your energy Zan!

She will just read something totally different

It is as hard as talking to Pyro sometimes but she has a good heart

[miltiades]

Lena, you are not asking a real question, you are trying to make a statement which is disguised as a question...

Are you telling me that we are the only people on earth who put up flags of their country within their territory?

Why is it bothering you so much anyway? Is it the flashy lights?

Forgive my intrusion young man but isn't Pentadaktylos in Cyprus , Turkey as close as it is to Cyprus , does not have territory as such it has land that it occupied by force , and don't bury your head in the sand , this how the International community , as well as Turkeys' strong supporter , the USA defines . To pretend that this Turkeys' territory is nonsense and stoking up unhealthy ingredients for the future generations to sort out . Don't ever think that Turkey will be permitted to annexe a part of a nation that does not want to be part of Turkey. It ain't going to happen mate , Turkey will remain in Cyprus for as long as the International community puts up with it , and here I'm referring To the EU mostly.

[shahmaran]

The flag is a TRNC flag miltiades...

And no one is asking to be annexed by Turkey!

[Simon]

As if you have a choice.

Turkey was threatening it before Cyprus joined the EU; was you asking for it then?

[shahmaran]

Oh yeah how can i forget! Its the evil Turkey we are talking about!

[LENA]

I want to be a billionaire but I am sensible enough to know that it is not going to happen. That is the same as wanting a united Cyprus but knowing that we cannot achieve it unless many changes are made. These changes are needed from both sides, yes, but the RoC are the ones that are claiming to represent the whole country and should make the road clearer. I hope you have understood what I am saying this time. You seem to go into defensive mode every time I have a go at the RoC. If there were nothing wrong then I would have nothing to have a go at.

The point about if things were not as they had been in the 60s, there would be many more TCs on the island is because the conditions for the GCs were not the same. I know many TCs that moved back to Cyprus and because of embargoes could not make a living and had to move back to their host countries. This is not the same for the GCs that moved back and all the ones that did move back are still there. Put simply, the TCs did not have the same opportunities so most did not even make the move. In fact many more moved out. You cannot apply the same logic to both communities.



There is also a difference in BEING a minority and having a minority status in the political world. I hope you can understand what I am saying.

Zan my dear … first of all….thank you about the compliment!
As for the above post…well yes I told you that I don’t disagree with you. I know that our government claim things in theory but we didn’t see much in practise.
What I am telling and you are not willing to understand is that, things can not change from one day to the other. Government need time…you know all the bureaucratically things that are needed to be done…and that takes time. What I said is that we slowly lead to that. But situation doesn’t help much either. You don’t want unification….you want partition why should we do all the changes and then tell us “no but thanks”! Zan we have to help that. You can not be a billionaire because you want to. You have to work hard, it will take you years … but may be one day your dream will become true.

See I am telling you Zan you look only one side. You said about TC that came back…and left because things doesn’t work as they thought … well imagine GC that they didn’t even come back to try because they are not able. They can not go back where they use to live because they are not allowed. Don’t look only what you want to see Zancim.

As for the minority thing…yes you are right it is different being a minority and have minority statues. But do you know how many GC have minority statues? Do you know that people that are refugees either they were lucky and were helped a lot or they fight for that… and others they still live in horrible houses and people doesn’t tried them well because they are just refugees. Zan things are not so easy you know. Life is shit…but we have to have the courage to move on and fight for a better life.