Cyprus-Forum.com

[Peterc]

I hear what you say Pirates, but my point is that I believe the majority of the TCs want the same as me. A Few on either side will always be confrontational. Why start these topics? We know that the outcome will be the same. Zan, what do you think?

[Murataga]

Piratis- you asked:

Should innocent people today and in the future be punished by means of ethnic cleansing and human rights violations based on events that happened many decades ago?

Stop demogogy, of course no "innocent" person should suffer. However, it is not we, the TCs who brought violence and bloodshed to the RoC. We did not embark on a lunatic adventure to secure, not independence for Cyprus, but its subjection to another state. We did not accept the independence agreements in 1960 with the intention of dishonoring them as soon as we could. We did not prepare and try to impose a clandestine plan to overthrow the Republic and to abrogate the treaties on which it was based. We did not attack and try to annihilate by force the other Cypriot people. We did not persecute them for years afterwards with savage inhumanity and heartless repression when they refused to succumb. We did not secretly bring into the island thousands of foreign troops in an attempt to create a fait accompli of its annexation to another State. And, in the end, it was not we who either provoked or launched the bloody coup d`etat in 1974 which compelled Turkey to intervene in Cyprus to stop the bloodshed and protect the Cypriots from a regime of terror headed by a homicidal maniac. If it is a compensation that is being asked from us for securing ourselves in a zone from all this, than the people who have committed these atrocities and illegalities shall be prepared to provide us with one aswell.

As far as the second post is concerned: the source you showed does not make it necessarily true as I have showed you a one that argues to the contrary, not to mention that the the one I showed was written by a GC. Here is something that might astonish you: there are things called "books". It is different than "google". And the one I referenced is here:

http://www.amazon.com/Rise-Fall-Cyprus- ... 0300020899

It is actually a very credible one that favors the GC side of the Cyprus conflict and yes I own it. Wehereas, the one you have showed us is one of subject to American foreign policy that without any doubt have taken the side of the GCs as it served their interests better in the Cyprus conflict. Let me know when you come up with something real.

[Piratis]

I hear what you say Pirates, but my point is that I believe the majority of the TCs want the same as me. A Few on either side will always be confrontational. Why start these topics? We know that the outcome will be the same. Zan, what do you think?

I wish you were right my friend.

However I am convinced that the majority are more or less like Zan, what they want is partition.

Even those that say they accept unification, they accept it just as a word, while in practice what they want is an association between Republic of Cyprus and "trnc" in the way Spain and Finland are associated within EU, thats what "unification" means to the great majority of the TCs that say they accept it.

I wish I am wrong and the majority of TCs would accept a truly united Cyprus without racist discriminations and without TCs gaining on the loss of GCs.

[pitsilos]

i am not in favour of war but one thing is certain. what was gained through war, there would come a time that it will be taken back through war. and as piradis is saying the tide might be changing.

War: Don't Name It, Just Win It! Turkey: Friend or Foe?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBykTi39 ... pic%3D1767

and on top of that we are seeing the armenian genocide bill in the us. if these ain't signs i don't know what they are.

Cyprus gets a mention right at the end.

[Piratis]

Piratis- you asked:

Should innocent people today and in the future be punished by means of ethnic cleansing and human rights violations based on events that happened many decades ago?

Stop demogogy, of course no "innocent" person should suffer. However, it is not we, the TCs who brought violence and bloodshed to the RoC. We did not embark on a lunatic adventure to secure, not independence for Cyprus, but its subjection to another state. We did not accept the independence agreements in 1960 with the intention of dishonoring them as soon as we could. We did not prepare and try to impose a clandestine plan to overthrow the Republic and to abrogate the treaties on which it was based. We did not attack and try to annihilate by force the other Cypriot people. We did not persecute them for years afterwards with savage inhumanity and heartless repression when they refused to succumb. We did not secretly bring into the island thousands of foreign troops in an attempt to create a fait accompli of its annexation to another State. And, in the end, it was not we who either provoked or launched the bloody coup d`etat in 1974 which compelled Turkey to intervene in Cyprus to stop the bloodshed and protect the Cypriots from a regime of terror headed by a homicidal maniac. If it is a compensation that is being asked from us for securing ourselves in a zone from all this, than the people who have committed these atrocities and illegalities shall be prepared to provide us with one aswell.

As far as the second post is concerned: the source you showed does not make it necessarily true as I have showed you a one that argues to the contrary, not to mention that the the one I showed was written by a GC. Here is something that might astonish you: there are things called "books". It is different than "google". And the one I referenced is here:

http://www.amazon.com/Rise-Fall-Cyprus- ... 0300020899

It is actually a very credible one that favors the GC side of the Cyprus conflict and yes I own it. Wehereas, the one you have showed us is one of subject to American foreign policy that without any doubt have taken the side of the GCs as it served their interests better in the Cyprus conflict. Let me know when you come up with something real.

you didn't answer the question: Should innocent people today and in the future be punished by means of ethnic cleansing and human rights violations based on events that happened many decades ago? Yes or No?

Instead you went on your usual crap on trying to blame the GCs. Sure GCs have blame also, 1% of it. So whats your point?

Or you were trying to tell us that "GCs started it" and theirfore GCs should be punished but TCs should not?

If this is what you were trying to tell us the in fact the Turks were the ones who started it all. If the Turks didn't invade our country in the first place, butchering 10s of thousands of people, then there wouldn't be a problem today.

Regarding your distorted version of history, a few points to correct your lies:
1) the TCs not for one day accepted independance. They continued working for their partition dream.
2) Even before 1963 TCs were importing weapons from Turkey to fight GCs for partition
3) The first intercommunal conflicts were started by TCs in the late 1950s.

So Murtaga, if you are trying to excuse crimes against us using lame excuses from the past then be sure you deserve the same in return.

[Piratis]

It is actually a very credible one that favors the GC side of the Cyprus conflict and yes I own it. Wehereas, the one you have showed us is one of subject to American foreign policy that without any doubt have taken the side of the GCs as it served their interests better in the Cyprus conflict. Let me know when you come up with something real.

Americans taking the side of GCs?? Do you tell a lot of such jokes?

The brutality of Turks is well known to everybody in the region. Ask the Armenians and Kurds as well, since along with us they are among your latest victims.

[free_cyprus]

everyone is talking alot of shit on this subject here

[Pyrpolizer]

Murataga,

I personally like your well presented posts and I praise you for that. They could lead to good discussions and good conclussions if the enviornment of participants was different.

On the other hand you have a fixation of drawing arbitrary conclussions. You say "the TCs did not do that, did not start this did not do that". When your conclussions are challenged you do not even reply. You carry on as usual.
In my opinion you are falling into exactly the same trap you are trying to avoid. That of the one sided look and comrehence of events.

I will try to find my response to your exact same "conclussions" that I posted you yesterday

[Murataga]

piratis- youasked:

Americans taking the side of GCs?? Do you tell a lot of such jokes?

On the Cyprus conflict, yes, their foreign policy is on the side of GCs. Their embassy was on your side the last time I checked, and they are the ones that do not recognize our state and put Turkey under an ambargo after 1974 (although for a short period)... Your reference is a subject of their foreign policy, the U.S. library of Congress, thus meaningless, unlike the one I presented that was written by a GC and referenced by many.

you didn't answer the question: Should innocent people today and in the future be punished by means of ethnic cleansing and human rights violations based on events that happened many decades ago? Yes or No?

Instead you went on your usual crap on trying to blame the GCs. Sure GCs have blame also, 1% of it. So whats your point?

The answer is clearly and correctfully presented if you carefully read my post. However, "reading" is apparently not one of your favorite past times ... Sorry to bust your bubbles but not everything that opposes your views and knowledge from racist GC propaganda is "crap" (as you chose to express).

[Pyrpolizer]

@Piratis,

Everybody tries to justify his own community thinking sentimentally. There is no objective reasoning in that. The most shining example is Zan who heard everything from his older sisters while he was in England from the age of 4. The same goes for many many GCs. There is no way for anyone to take away that sentiment from anyone. It's like watching a horor movie and someone laughing at you and telling you they were all lies. Lies or not, what matters is how you (in plural) feel.

This is where we are today.